How to be sublime in an Architecture Interview Online

How to be sublime in an Architecture Interview Online
===

Will Ridgway: [00:00:00] It's Tuesday.

Jack Moran: It's three o'clock. It's the 18th of August. That means it's time for another episode of Careers in Architecture with us, the team at the Architecture Social. I'm your host, Jack Moran, joined by Stephen Drew and Wilbur Tway. Good afternoon, guys. Hello.

Will Ridgway: Good afternoon. How are you doing?

Stephen Drew: I'm all good.

How are you guys? I'm living the, I'm living the COVID dream. I'm boiling. I'm sweating buckets. This is not prime conditions. Good thing I'm not doing an online interview right now, huh? Because this is not what you want to wear. This is not how you want to look. This is basically how not to do it. So let's talk about how to do it then.

So Will, first of all, are you wearing your trousers right now?

Will Ridgway: I am not wearing what I would normally wear for an interview. I'm wearing like my loungewear. You're wearing

Stephen Drew: lazy loungewear? Oh, I'm proud of you.

Will Ridgway: [00:01:00] Yeah, I'm not, I'm not doing an interview, I'm not doing an interview, but that is definitely something I did want to talk about.

Jack Moran: All right, good all good stuff aside, let's let's dive into today's topic, which is going to be how to be sublime when interviewing online. Now that's a bit of a catch to it, isn't it? Yeah, you're proud of that jingle, aren't you, Mr. Sublime over here? I mean, essentially, though, you think about it, that is going to be A lot of interviews going forward, isn't it?

You know, the very structure of how interviews, the whole hiring process has been done has been shaken to the core. So I definitely think it's something that's worth talking about because interviewing online is, you know, Really different fundamentally to actually being there first face to face. Do you guys have any initial thoughts on the sort of, you know, online versus people?

Stephen Drew: Yeah. Do you know what, so this kind of came about, didn't it? Cause we did a nice little now long vision of interviewing and by default, I almost kept going back to my experience, which [00:02:00] was interviewing physically and digitally is the new world like it or not. Even, even for myself now, I work part time. At home, and a lot of the time doing that, we're in online meetings, and it's the same kind of thing of actually, it's like this now, you don't, you almost, you need to rehearse it, you need to get your own zone, and you need to be ready.

Put it this way, if I go into the management meeting wearing a t shirt, And with my hair all sweaty like this now and stuff, it's not good. And you kind of, so you kind of need to dress your best because I think most interviews right now will be digital will be online. And I, I think lots of the ones that in terms of what we're doing in recruitment.

I'm, I'm booking all in Zoom meetings and stuff. So yeah, you really need to get on, you need to basically practice your online interview, which is a bit of a new thing for me, as it is for a lot of the candidates right now. [00:03:00] So, Let's jump in. So, so I think half of it kind of comes down to, I don't want to say it's almost common sense, but what it is is I think that you've got the old techniques of before, which is all the stuff we talked about in the interviews.

Think about it, the interview by itself is still a conversation, right? So we still have the old essences, of an interview before, but now what we've got to do is we've got to prepare for it differently and we're going to make sure that we're tech savvy enough that it doesn't interrupt the interview because what you don't want right now is for you to have technical problems or for instance to have your children screaming in the background or have your neighbors outside Hey Jeff!

Bring me over here in a minute! You've got to make sure that everything is Tip top and like this pristine.

Jack Moran: You think about that [00:04:00] as well. So it's all essentially zoom is going to be all, all the the most popular platform essentially for what people will be interviewing on. Good thing as well.

Stephen Drew: Yeah, I mean, it's like teams though, Jack, I, I hate teams.

Sorry, Bill Gates. If you're watching, I hate teams. And the thing is, it's like, you know, some. We had a bit of a giggle about it, didn't we, that actually our MD, even though we've got a Zoom license, sent us a team link, and you're like, Oh no, I've got to sign up to it! And the thing is, whatever platform the people are interviewing on, you kind of, especially in this market right now, you're going to go to it.

This is no time to go, may I suggest you go on to Zoom? No, you've just got to sign up to whatever. And some of them are really bad, like I hate Teams, right? You hate all this stuff and you've got to make sure that it's all set up, ready to go. So, first thing, do you have a laptop or a phone? Okay? You need to make sure that you can share files.

Because I imagine right now that you're going to be sharing, it could be a [00:05:00] few different things. It could be that the interviewer asks you to do a screen share, and therefore you probably want your PDF portfolio and CV on your computer ready. If it's a screen share, what you don't want to do is for it to pop up and it'll see on the background like your Discords with random chats and stuff like me and you the other day, Jack, remember my Discord popped up?

Luckily, there was nothing bad there, but it's like, you've got to make sure There's

Jack Moran: a big point there where you're going on though, because if you think, if you go to screen share, not everyone is going to sort of think, hold on, what's on my, what's on my browsers or what have I been working on? Oh, it's, it's stuff like

Stephen Drew: this.

It's even like, look, let's just say you share your computer with other people. You want to make sure your browser history and all this stuff. All the stuff is all crystal clear. You want to make sure there's no files on the desktop. Or for instance, so when I was in architecture, you might call things, files like final, or this is ready.

One, one, one, one, one, one, one, one, or this is can't swear because we're going to go live in Spotify, but this is [00:06:00] da, da. You don't want any of that emotive stuff. You've got to be really professional. And what you don't want is like a background of you. Girlfriend or something, you know, on, on the background.

Try and keep it like put the background, like a nice little bit of architecture or something, you know what I mean? So what you wanna do is you wanna have like this crystal clear showroom. You need to make sure that your Internet's good enough. And if it's not, you need to go somewhere really strong internet and you need to make sure that you have.

somewhere, which is not noisy. You need no distractions. It's like this. Now I might have to answer the door at some point doing this whole thing, which is exactly, basically, if you're watching this right now, this is exactly how not to do it. I might have someone that come in at the door. I'm all sweaty and barbed.

I'm not really looking into the camera. You almost want the camera to be like eye level or something. And you don't want to have your. You want your double chin there like me, I've put a bit of weight on lately.

Jack Moran: They're not

Stephen Drew: gonna care about whether or not you have a double chin, that's just Stephen being paranoid.

No, that's just me, no I'm making a point though, you [00:07:00] want no distractions, you don't want a weird camera angle like this, do you get what I mean? You don't want phones.

Jack Moran: You

Stephen Drew: don't

Jack Moran: want your phone going on in

Stephen Drew: that band. Mum, I'm in an interview! You don't want

Jack Moran: Why don't, why don't, why don't we pick it up Will as well, what do you think?

Stephen Drew: Do you think this is a flattering angle? I don't think so, it's not a flattering

Will Ridgway: angle. I think the best way to have the camera is either have it on top of your screen because what you want to do is you want to always make eye contact. with the camera because it's much more engaging but I found that for me, for example, it's very difficult for me to look at my camera because I often keep looking at my screen.

My monitor is right in front of me there, but my camera is here. So one of the ways that you might want to, if you've got a laptop, usually your webcam is right above the monitor. So the screen, so it's not really a bit of an issue there because when you're looking at the screen, you're generally also looks like you're looking at the camera as well.

But I would try and get near the screen so you can look at the screen and look at the camera at the same time or you have to just focus on the camera when you're speaking because it's much more engaging [00:08:00] and I've seen people as well they've put stuff behind the camera so that there's something actually interesting to look at whereas at the moment I have nothing behind mine and I'm really struggling to

Stephen Drew: maintain

Will Ridgway: eye

Stephen Drew: contact.

I've got my little, maybe get rid of stuff like that because then I've got my little switch in the background on my fan. Oh yeah, turn your Alexa off, Alexa. You don't want her going off. You know what I mean? So you'd be like great

Jack Moran: stuff from Stephen as to what not to do in the online. Yeah.

Stephen Drew: This is all the wrong things are just because this is, this is the moment where you've got to get ready.

Stuff like as well, posture, right? And good lighting. Try to get good lighting on the camera. You don't want to look like you're in 1987. You want to look. So there's a lot of high definition, because I think there's something about that, you subliminally have a better camera, you always think the person is well presented.

It's strange. I think it's all about these little things of, don't wear a T shirt like this, wear a shirt. And a shave. [00:09:00] Look, like what Will said, while I was choking around a bit with a truth in it, that basically you don't want to look like you're going on Instagram or like that, you need to, and you don't want it like too high up or unengaged, you want it Exactly like the conditions that would be on a table, where like Will right now looks right about right, as in I can imagine him across the table.

Somehow I look a bit low. So you want to kind of go up there, you want to look forward, and you want to look straight on. If you have a webcam, then great. You can put lights on, you can buy lights online. So I use, I've got a light here, let me show you this. for that you use for the social and for all these videos and you can buy them they're only like 20 quid or something and you think about it if you can just make yourself look better you're going to be using these when you do meetings and stuff anyways in this new crazy world so buy one of them for 20 quid and that really helps because without the lighting my room's quite dark Dark.

And what you don't want to do is you, if you can, you want to try to [00:10:00] manipulate the room into the conditions that you want to present yourself in. So you want it to be bright, you want to be energetic, and you want to sound good. And that's the other point. So I use a microphone right now. Oh, I can show you that as well.

So I got my little, I got a little microphone here as well. If you haven't got that though, just get headphones or something with like really good sound. What you don't want is that maybe you can test the webcam. If you've got like a bad webcam, you don't want it kind of picking up all the muffles and You don't want it to be any good because the last thing you're going to do is turn it off.

I didn't

Jack Moran: think about that actually, Stephen, so What I was gonna, this is actually a really top tip and in our company meeting some people fall victim to this. You know you're talking about webcams on like laptops per se. A lot of older laptops come with both webcams and microphones built in. What people don't realize though is that if they've got a speaker on a laptop, oh yeah, people's voices are coming out of that.

But then your microphone is also on the same laptop and you're talking in. So [00:11:00] you've got sound coming out and sound going back in. So you're just creating a massive echo loop and we have our meetings and all it will do is send everyone up the wall because the noise repeating, repeating, repeating. So make sure if you do use a laptop with a microphone, put headphones in first.

Otherwise the sound will pick up and it will repeat. And your interview will probably last about. Three minutes.

Will Ridgway: Wow. It's very distracting, isn't it, to try and talk whilst you hear the loop, and you hear your own voice as well. It's not very good. I

Stephen Drew: hate, I hate the loop. So you're onto something. So you need to test it all out before, and basically you need to test it out.

So now it's about, so the trade off is that online you don't need to traipse around London in a suit. Basically, all hot and bothered. So remember, you're not doing that. You're right. So like Jack says, you want to get rid of the feedback groups. You want to get rid of all that stuff. You don't want to be the person who's in the meeting, driving, going like, Hiya!

You alright? Yeah! I'm just done. So you want it to be like in [00:12:00] a room or Almost imagine it like the apprentice room, you know, and it's like quiet and you almost want it that it's neutral you Maybe you could put an architecture book in the background or something like that a little taste there The focus should be about you And this is the this is what we're on about When you've got feedback loops and annoying stuff kicking off like that What it does is it distracts from the conversation and when that happens You basically, you lose focus.

People lose focus. And what Jack's on about, when I get feedback, what happens is, I switch off. I don't listen. Yeah, and when you're irritated, you just, you don't concentrate anymore. And when you don't concentrate anymore, what happens then is You lose the person. It's all about engagement. And it's the same thing as like, what's a boring presentation to watch as well as an interesting one.

So you really need to [00:13:00] engage the person. And so the number one barrier to keep engagement right now is the tech technical side needs bang on. You want to think about what was, we talked about lighting. We talked about sound isolation. You want, You've got to make sure you get no distractions in. You don't want kids screaming in the background.

I know everyone's busy and I know it's really difficult if you're a parent juggling things. You've just got to make sure that no one's around for that time. If, for instance, you're a student, check the connection. If you're into some of the student gaff and you've got this dodgy network that pings out half and every and you're on a Wi Fi, you really got to maybe try and get a wired connection.

You got to get everything set up. And so I like what you were saying earlier, Will and Jack, about If you've got teams of whatever, you need to at least test, you should at least go on to Discord or something and get your friend A, to test that the microphone works and the video works. Because we had it before, remember the first one that [00:14:00] we did of this, where, well, your webcam wouldn't work, and then the second one, mine wouldn't work!

And it was like, oh no! And this, and luckily we came on half an hour before to fix these problems. The thing is You just can't leave things up to chance and because if you leave it up to the moment, you're really risking it. And if you're risking it, could work out okay, could work out not okay. What you don't want right now is that I'm not going to beat around the bush.

This is a tough time for everyone. So if you can get an interview right now, we need to seize the moment. You can really do. As much as you, as you can, you can, but you can do your best. What I'm saying is, you don't want to be on an A game with an A grade portfolio and A grade CV, and the whole interview is tampered by dodgy connections and bad sound because you haven't thought [00:15:00] about that.

Or, it's a dark video, and you, maybe you're not wearing the right glasses. Attire. So don't wear your pants. Definitely wear trousers, like Will says. You want to wear your trousers on. You know, you want to get, you want to be all presented for any kind of mad scenario. You want to get get the CV and portfolio files ready.

Maybe even have a digital copy printed out that you can hold up or something. So you can be like this, this, that, and that. But you want to make sure that the files work. Test that the file works. Remember if you can have a big hundred meg file, it probably isn't gonna be easy to display. Think about the realistic constraints that we are in right now.

So

Jack Moran: definitely that's good for thought as well. What you were just saying. So, you know, for like a, say like an employer's side, if they are interview hiring like one position and they do like 10 zoom. Interviews over the space of two days. [00:16:00] Quite tedious, isn't it, for the interviewer to actually do that?

Even just to sit through that. So out of those ten interviews, do you want to be that person who's known as, oh yeah, we had this person, looked alright, but we couldn't hear a word they were saying because of their connection? Or do you want to be that person who's saying, you know what, this person had a good portfolio.

Really strange enough, but really crystal clear camera and the microphone was good and they're well presented. Everything looked professional. All these small things that Stephen's going into are going to add up to essentially a big decision, which is, could be, you know, the future of your employment or not.

Yeah, I definitely think we need to go on to the, the, the portfolio as well, guys, because it's, it's a bit different, isn't it? Because we're not. Now we're not going to be attending a place where we can bring a, you know, a spanky, nice looking you know, well done portfolio, but instead we've got to work with the more raw, raw material.

So we're going to be doing our screen share, aren't we? Yes, so what

Will Ridgway: guys, I want to go first, because What I want to talk about is, first of all, you need to familiarize yourself with the screen share option. Now, Zoom has a screen share, Teams has [00:17:00] screen share, Skype does as well, Discord does, but no one uses Discord for interviews.

But find out, first of all, if they have a screen share option, and if you do, familiarize yourself how you get it working. Now, what I would first of all do is I'll have all your, I'd have your CV, your sample portfolio, your full portfolio, your technical portfolio, And then any other supporting documents all in one file, so that it's very easy to find.

You have it there open, so you can just quickly go through them all and then you can talk to you. You can talk to them about each particular one. It's important to have the CV there so you can talk about that, but then also your portfolio. But you got to make sure as well that it's, it's organized in a way.

That it is, it's easy for you to navigate through because the reality is you're not going to go through the entire portfolio, just like you wouldn't in real life. So it's important you can, you're able to chunk it down and then give them the option, as we said you know, a previous webinar. Whether or not you want to go in further.

And that's why also the [00:18:00] technical portfolio is important as a separate document. So you can just show some of that as well, just to show that you've done it, if you have done it. And then of course the, the other supporting documents as well, I think that'd be very important to have as well. Whether they like your paintings, sculptures, whatever else for you, like hobbies, that's important to have all in one place so that you can find it easily and you can just, you know, share them all, all in one go.

And it saves as well, how to go. in your desktop trying to find which documents are which so it's all organized in one place makes it a lot easier means you can get through a lot more stuff as well in the interview.

Stephen Drew: So what I don't, what I'm curious so I wonder you need to find out before the interview whether you're presenting the work or they're gonna flick through it almost because I wonder whether or not they get the file or what I imagine they will do is they will ask you to present it.

Okay, and if, if you are presenting your file, your screen sharing, you need to do it, it's the [00:19:00] same skills that we talked about. So what I'd like to do is, so this isn't going to be the hour long talk that we did before an interview, because I think that's a very good general introduction and overview of an interview.

What this is about is in depth. Stealing the bits we talked about in that interview video in a digital medium. And so my point is, as Will was saying, you're going to find out how to share this file and how you're going to present it. What you don't want to do is bang on for ages, almost. Boring the interviewer to death because you, you're, you control, when you control the medium, it's like, it's when an interview you have a physical document that you can go through together and you're, you're almost like you're flicking through a story with them and you're assessing the pace based upon the person.

So you need to pay real attention in this Digital Online Interview, when people are kind of have a glazed look over their [00:20:00] face, you've got to think about the pace, you've got to think about how fast they're going, how fast you're going, how slow maybe you're going, and you need to assess. So this is the, whether or not you need to speed up or slow down, you do not want to stay forever on one sheet, and you do not want to start with your work further away.

You want to talk about your most relevant work straight away. This is normally industry experience, and then it's normally after your academic project, your most recent academic, going down to your later academic. What you don't want to do is start off on what you did during your first year of Part 1, then first year of Part 2, and first year of Part 3.

Such an anti climatic thing to do, and loads of people make the mistake. And if you've already worked in industry, you need to talk about that, because guess what? You were hiring someone, ideally with industry experience. If you're a [00:21:00] graduate, okay, it's not expected. If you have something, for instance, work experience, so forth, you should always jump in with that first.

I would because it's what the employer is hiring you for. They're hiring you to work on a professional team using software online projects. So if you've worked on live projects, it's good. Highlight during the interview softwares that you've been using. This is an example of work that I've done in Revit.

This is Photoshop. This is certain software that I've, I've used. And then, so in the interview, remember they, we talked about getting your kit perfect. Be prepared that their kit isn't perfect. Be prepared that their connection isn't perfect. Be prepared for things to drop out. And if, worst case, things do go wrong, Stay calm.

Try to be humoring about it. My doorbell goes right now. I've got to answer it. That's why I almost make a joke about it.

Jack Moran: Stephen, if I can just draw back [00:22:00] to one of your presentation points, you picked up on something quite fundamental there. Presentations themselves, you know, are quite a big thing, aren't they?

Because it takes a lot of skill to do so. But presenting, like, say, over a screen share, what you said about the idea of running on for too long and It's quite imperative actually, you're not stood in a room full of people this time where you'll be, you know, actively going through your portfolio physically, you'll be doing it online on a computer.

So what a lot of people might run the risk of is, you know, Really actually talking too fast or talking too slowly. This is why I would say it's a suggestion to do a mock presentation with a friend, with an old colleague, with a student friend, it doesn't matter who, but just say, do you mind if I have 10 to 20 minutes of your time just so I can get an idea of what it's like to talk about my portfolio online and not talk about it in front of people, because it's a lot more interactive when you're face to face, but doing it online would run the risk of, you know, you, Essentially babbling on for too long, or you might start doing the annoying thing of just scrolling [00:23:00] down, you know, you say to me, Stephen, I'm too fast on a computer sometimes, but it can be distracting, can't it?

And if people are scrolling through their portfolio at a million miles per hour, they're going to run the risk. So, Top tip would definitely be to do some sort of mock presentation on your portfolio just to get an idea of, you know, the key things that you want to talk about. That, that was the point I wanted to make, Adam.

Stephen Drew: Yeah, I like it. And the other thing I was going to mention is that, so on my screen right now. I've, so what I was looking at is that my track was down here, and you know it's sort of, this whole thing I've been kind of talking here, because I can see Jack's face. Hiya Jack, I'm well down here. Hiya, right?

But the thing is, what you want to do is, you want to put it, if you can, nearer where the camera is, so like this now, already. It's looking closer and then try to remind yourself to look into the camera as much as possible. So if I did the whole thing like this, this is much more engaging than basically looking down here all the time.

So you can look up to the camera and then maybe you go into the thing and you go like, [00:24:00] nah, dah, dah, dah, dah. So what I'm doing Jeff is that I did this project and that is much more engaging. Try to look at eye contact. It's like a YouTuber. They don't go, what's happening guys. They go, Hey, what's happening guys.

I am Stephen Drew and because you're looking at the camera, so you want to try and capture eye contact. You want to get the lighting looking good. You want to make sure that your connections working well. You're going to get your CV and portfolio tip top ready. Make sure that the files are perfect. Make sure that you've sent them across just in case anything goes wrong.

Make sure the compression is perfect. is good. The drawings are crisp. You don't want anything blurry. Make sure that the file's not too long. So, I mean, the theme of this whole little tidbit that we're doing now is You need to instill the same old school things [00:25:00] of why an interview works. Remember that they're hiring a person and you in the interview, you need to get across.

You need to convince them why they're going to hire you. So you need to do that, the old school techniques in the other video that we've done, with what we've talked about here of thinking about how do you convey emotion? How do you convey? Interests. How do you convey excitement about working at this company and how do you convey all the stuff that you've done in all the good stuff in your, in your portfolio so that they hire you?

That's the whole goal is to get hired right now. And I think if you, if you use technology, As a strength right now, it's going to help you out. So what I'm on about is, if you invest a little bit of money in a webcam, it's always going to be useful because we're all online. And [00:26:00] you're probably going to work part time online at home in this new world and part time in an office anyways.

So invest! In a webcam, invest in a good headset. I think like an I iPhone. I'm not, I'm not up to date with the kids. How much is that? iPhone? Newest.

Jack Moran: iPhone is like, that's a lot about

Stephen Drew: the headphones. Someone about like,

Jack Moran: oh, the pods, even though they're like a few hundred pound, but you can, there are alternative.

I've got these for 40. I think I've got maybe a little less than that. Amazon, they do these for 40, 50 pounds. I think me and Will got near enough the same ones, but they are, I think they're really good. I like them because I want to get away. I want to get

Stephen Drew: rid of these. I don't like these flying saucers I've got on my head.

I think they would be a bit distracting. And what I quite like is Will's little AirPod one. So I'm going to invest in one of them. Will, you need to send me the link actually after this. That would be handy. Cause what I don't like is in these videos that I do, I've got this big thing and they [00:27:00] make your ears really hot.

I mean, they're quite nice sounding, doesn't matter right now, so you want to get rid of all this and maybe get like, so you look like, like, well, which way you look like you're reporting the evening news. Bodyguard. So, I think if you invest in a good camera and this kind of stuff, it's going to be useful for your career right now, and what I'm saying is, you're probably going to be an advantage to someone who hasn't thought about all this stuff.

And I wonder if you do an experiment right now, everyone will say subjectively. Sorry, everyone was saying like, look, it doesn't matter about technology, it doesn't matter about this. The best candidate, the best work will get the job. My point is though, that people are assessing who is the best based upon this interview and all the technology and all the emotion pays and pays off.

And that is the bit that's going to tip the odds in your favor because the strength of your work. [00:28:00] Okay, let's say now you've got a killer CV and portfolio. If you've got amazing technology and you can manipulate the situation that we're in right now to your advantage by sounding crisp, looking at an emotion, and you're in a room which is quiet, you've set everything up, you've tested it, the focus is going to be on that work and the focus is going to be on you.

And I guarantee you You will get the job offer over someone that has equally as good a portfolio, but the interview let them down a little bit. Because there's something about when people make a decision after, they'll be like, Oh yeah, but Jack Super professional, he was engaged, he had, you know, CV portfolio was there, and saying, oh, Will was the same level, but his, maybe it was a bit harder to hear Will, and it was like, yeah, I liked him.

I just felt that me and Jack had a bit more of a connection. What? And you're like, what? That's insane! That's how people [00:29:00] work. And because you're not there in a room with someone right now, you can't convey their emotions. So you have to use the tools to, in your disposal. It's like me, when I started this, I had a little headset, which, because I found it sounded really, it was really convenient for me.

And what I've learned is that the microphone sounds better. And getting a high definition camera sound, it looks professional. And what the other thing is that I buy these lights and they, you know, Absolutely shining me and I'm like, oh, it kind of looks crisp and more professional. And it's all these things which add up to make the overall picture of you better.

So that's my summary for it. I don't really have much to add to that. I think that you need to manipulate all the software you can to, and so all the hardware, learn the software, buy the nice webcam, spend a few pounds. I know it's not the best time you're going to forever use online software. It's [00:30:00] the new world.

Get that, test everything out, Make sure your CV and portfolio is there, make sure you've got no dodgy files on your, on your desktop, and dress smart, and try to enjoy it, because if you've got all that ticking for you, I think you're in a really good position, so you can then relax, and be yourself, because that's what's going to get you the job.

Well, also,

Jack Moran: if someone does happen to walk into your room, halfway through, You know, the interview or something, you know, a child should walk in or a pet walks in. Don't go on a mad one and start shouting obscenities and profanities at them because we're not going to do any favours. Everyone knows that, you know, your employer, your potential employers will always know that you're at home.

They know what life is like. Just say apologize, ask them to leave politely and get back to it. Play it cool. Do not let it throw you off your balance. Okay. I think that's a definitely a big thing. We've all seen that BBC clip, haven't we? The famous one where, yeah, exactly. But he played it cool. Like he just, he literally, he [00:31:00] waited for them to go and then he, and then he carried on and you forget about it.

So these things happen. Just play it cool. Keep a calm head and do your best, you know, do your best.

Stephen Drew: Just try and remind them that you've got the interview beforehand,

Jack Moran: you

Stephen Drew: know, and maybe probably they'll sign on the door. But if, like, Amazon knocks on your door, because that's the one I got, my alarm bell goes beep, beep, beep, and it could go any second now, you're right, you've got to embrace it, and you've got to adapt.

Yes. Definitely. Well, what do you, what are you, any, any words of William Wisdom before we go?

Will Ridgway: One William Wisdom. Would be that there's often a time delay when you're on online interviews. So it's important to listen and then pause before start speaking because otherwise you end up a bit of, sometimes you end up clashing and speaking over the top of each other.

It's not very good. So it's, you know, take the time to pause. It's not awkward. Let it happen and then speak that, that, that'd the only thing I'd else have to say.

Stephen Drew: Cool.

Jack Moran: Alright. All these small things, [00:32:00] but they'll all make a big difference in the end, won't they guys?

Stephen Drew: I think so. So what should we talk about next week?

I kind of like this short little format. It's something like boom, boom, boom to the point. Maybe what we'll do is we'll, we'll ask what you guys want to talk about next week and maybe what we'll do. How about this? So on the Architecture Social, if you haven't signed up to it yet, it's a community platform full of students, professionals, and more and more employers every day.

Well, maybe what we'll do is we'll put a poll on there. And see what people want to talk about and it would maybe it can be next week we can have Tuesday's William Wisdom session with a choice of whatever you want so perhaps if you're not joined on the Architecture Social check out www.

architecturesocial. com you can sign up to the community it's absolutely free and if you are an existing member we will put that post on after this but thank you so much for signing it and listening.

Jack Moran: I think that wraps us up for this week. So thanks everyone for joining and enjoy the rest [00:33:00] of your week.

We'll see you next week. Thank you very much. Goodbye. Everybody.