How to prepare and start a new job at an Architecture Practice, FULL THROTTLE!

0007 - How to prepare and start a new job at an Architecture Practice, FULL THROTTLE!
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Jack Moran: [00:00:00] It's Tuesday, it's 3:00 PM That means it's time for another architecture social webinar. Ooh, Jack Moran. Joined by Steven Drew. Hello And Will Ridgeway. Hello. How are we doing, guys?

Stephen Drew: You okay? Oh, it's quite hot, Jack. I'm not, I'm wearing a t-shirt. This is the hottest day of the year, do you think?

Or? Yesterday. Yesterday was pretty hot.

Jack Moran: It's, have you guys bought some fans for your rooms? I've got fans,

Stephen Drew: but I can't have them on

Jack Moran: right now. Because we've gone on live, I can't be having this in the back. Right guys, so what we are going to dive into today, it's a bit of a niche topic, but I think there is a lot of important things.

That we can cover that a lot of people are going to take a good use for. So it's all going to be centered around the idea of starting a new job at an architecture practice. So Stephen, you've been there very much yourself, haven't you? And that first step, cause [00:01:00] going into a practice is different, than an office, isn't it?

It's different than a lot of other types of working areas. It's slightly different because it's it may, it's

Stephen Drew: the, it's the Obviously, we design in buildings, but you've got the creative aspects and the business aspects as well. So an architectural practice, you're typically going to be on a computer.

You're going to have your own computer. You can have your own software. So the first thing you want to do is find out what that architectural practice is using. They should have mentioned it in an interview and probably it's really good to zip and get upgraded before you go, get freshened up.

The last thing you want to do is join on the first day and then the person you're next to, because you want to make a good impression. So when you get there, obviously, say hello to everyone. Try to be social. Try to go a bit out of your comfort zone. If you're a shy person, it's definitely worth saying hello, making an impression.

You don't have to be too long, you don't have to gush, you do anything like that. What you do need to do is the friends that you make here, especially if there's any other part ones as well, make an effort and make an effort and go around. But back to the software. What you don't want to do on the first day is [00:02:00] after you said hi to Jeff, and Jeff thinks, oh, he's a nice guy, then you're the person going,

do the, how do I copy and paste? Oh, cheers, Jeff. And then the next 10 minutes, Jeff, sorry, you're like, oh, no you, because Jeff's busy as well. So it's good to ask a few questions, but you want to fit, you want to cover the basics so that when you can ask a question, and they're going to say, ask a few questions, but there's that element of, Maybe you can start focusing the questions more on learning architecture, whereas the software is something that you can probably do on your own level.

Maybe it's something like with Revit, you will talk, for instance, about how the company does BIM, but what you don't want to do is go in there and be like, okay, Can you just tell me everything from the start? What is BIM? And I'm like, oh no, because you could have done that on your own. You would have been at the company and the stuff that you want to do when you're in practice is that you want to basically go there and be like, I've [00:03:00] done a little bit of detailing before, I've done it in industry.

What would you do on this task? And normally what they'll do is they'll give you a task. But let's zone back in. So the stuff to do before. You go somewhere. So you've got a job. It's great. Okay. First thing you want to do, you probably should message the HR, which is great saying that you're excited to join.

And also, if you've got a particular team leader, why don't you go a little bit out of your way in the theme of what we always talk about in this place. And why don't you call the company and you call up Jeff and you say, look, Jeff, we really appreciate you're going to have the other team. It means a lot to me I can't wait to join, and I just wanted to let you know thank you, and also while I'm here, is there anything you'd like me to do before the interview?

Is there anything you'd like me to read? Is there anything you'd like me to be familiar with? Or is there any software? Pause, and you let them ask, because that's helpful, isn't it? And for instance, one of our clients, a really great [00:04:00] company, they, for instance, were doing elderly living, and they had a book.

They made their own book, and what they give is the start of the book before they joined. And the person read the book two weeks before, You get all excited, you learn about Jeff's team, you learn about what Jeff's up to, so that when you join in, you feel involved already, and you have something to talk about.

So a lot of what I'm on about is familiarity, and I guess what I wanted to talk about today is, if you can, for instance, almost go in there where they know you a little bit more than fresh, that's nice. And it's nice to ask questions. Yeah, you say hello to the HR, but the person that hired you is going to be an architectural director who saw some value.

And I think if you reach out to that person and you say you say something, A, it's memorable and thankful, and then you're asking them, ideally on the phone, and then Worst case, then in an email, you're asking them what you should do to prepare, because I think that will focus it around. If you don't get [00:05:00] anything, or let's say, you're starting a contract role in a week's time, then you're gonna, you might have a huge amount of time to do research, but you should always use the time you've got.

So if you start on the job in a day or two, then you really want to jump in and then go through the company's website, you want to go through the software, you want to make sure that you have clothes to wear. Sounds crazy, right? But it's good to have. Maybe at least one suit. Remember though an architectural practice isn't hugely formal.

What I did is that I had a suit and I would wear the suit for the first few days and I would literally sit down and put the jacket on the back of the seat and I would work in a nice shirt. Not too expensive, not too cheap. Nice little Marks and Spencers jobby. You get a few of them, lovely. Or John Lewis, let's get you some of them nice white shirts, and you get about five to ten of them, and you wear your suit. What you don't want to do, and I always tease Will about this, when he joined the company, remember you wear the suit every day, And then, but you know what? It is really respectful and it's [00:06:00] good to have it there. What I think is really important is to care and, wear a suit or, wear, male, female, get some professional attire because it looks really good.

But what you definitely don't need to do, though, is be glued in your head. What are they called? Jacket! Suit jacket. You don't need to be glued in that all day. You definitely, probably, I would wear a tie for the first few days and then you slowly want to wear it down. And not wear it down to the point where you're wearing like A V-neck shirt or any of the t-shirts or anything like that, you don't want to come across and get these, the wrong connotations.

What you do want to do though, is you want to, you'll find that typically in an architecture office, they will be wearing jumpers, smart, casual, and over time when you get to know the company culture. You can relax a little bit, but you will always be with this kind of trendy twist. So it might be trendy shoes.

It might be chinos. Chinos are a good one. And then a [00:07:00] really nice colorful shirt and then a jumper to wear over it or something like that. Or a white shirt and a jumper, a polo shirt jumper over it. Now it's going to be a bit hot for that. So you probably just want to have a nice shirt. And I wear quite flamboyant flowery shirts.

But you don't need to be that guy, you can wear a nice white shirt, it really doesn't matter what you wear in that way, but you just want to come across like you care, on that

Jack Moran: on that note, Steve, just before we get wheel salts as well just had a question come in which is quite good, quite relevant actually saying, Hey guys, what do you think is absolutely necessary to take with you on your first week?

Okay. We're going from scratch here. What are we taking? Okay.

Stephen Drew: There's one or two good books, actually. There was like, what was it, The Architect's Handbook? You really want something with like measurements and dimensions. So I think there was one book, and we'll put it on one of the competitions on thearchitecturesocial.

com, which is The Architect's Pocket Guide. What you want is like a really good quick reference for basic stuff. So say now someone asks you to [00:08:00] draw risers on stairs. Sometimes this book can be really helpful and tell you the questions that you were going to bother Jeff with, again, in the analogy.

So I think that's really good. You don't want to take too much. I bought, it's always nice to buy a briefcase. And what's quite funny is like, whenever I get a job, my dad goes, Oh, there's no more. I call you a nice briefcase so you can go to the job, right? But you know what? They're really handy. So maybe not a briefcase, but what I call a man bag.

That's very, when you've got your bits and bobs in there, you've got your, you, it's good to take a few, you want to take a few nice pens. You're probably going to be given a notepad or something. What you'll find in an architectural practice is that they'll give you a book to log stuff down, because that can be a legally binding document.

Sometimes that, in a meeting, you take the notes. So you'll find that they'll kit you out. What oh, yeah, I tell you what, Will brought it up before this, actually. There's probably a few legal documentations, which is really good to take on your first date. So maybe you want to run through the stuff that normally we ask for in recruitment, Will, [00:09:00] and normally the stuff that HR might ask you on your first day to bring.

Will Ridgway: Yeah, absolutely. A lot of this stuff they might ask you before you even come in and you can just send the photocopies over, but practices will need to have like passports, for example, so it's always worth bringing your passport in if they've not already received the passport. You'd also want which one's the one from BIM?

When you've just finished a job. Yeah, so P45. P45, that's it. So you might have to bring that one, that in as well. But it's mainly, that's only if they've not previously asked for it beforehand because they'll need to use it at some point. And your National Insurance number for getting the payroll, but that might already be sorted beforehand.

But it's always worth just having those handy in case you get asked to bring them in the next day. You can be like, actually I've got them here now, would you like them? Yeah, which I can see around the later, because it's better, because then that way they can get everything sorted for you quicker, rather than having to wait for you to find it at home, because, it's my passport.

I have no idea where my passport is at the moment. I have to go looking around my entire room to go find it. I have an idea where it might be. But yeah, I don't know where it is, so it's always worth having that handy [00:10:00] so that you can, so that you can just bring it in or just have it with you. Don't

Stephen Drew: worry, Will, you won't be going on any airplanes anytime soon in this world.

No, I

Will Ridgway: know. That's why be looking

Stephen Drew: for another job, so you won't need that passport. No, I won't. Take your bank account details as well, that's the one everyone forgets. Because you want to get paid, right? So it's always the most important thing to bring that as well. And yeah, I think that's the kind of stuff you want to take.

So for me, it's more about the mindset before going, because so as Will talked about, you've got your passport, these details to get paid, and You're taking, national insurance. Really the, it's more about your mind frame. We talked about dressing appropriately for it, and it's more about not getting yourself in the weeks building up to it, into an absolute kerfuffle and panicky.

You might. So if you go into a physical place, that's what you want to do. You want to get your clothes. You want to get all this stuff. Really good question, Sunny, you brought in. Right now, we're in a bit of a strange thing. We're actually onboarding. It could even be digital, right?[00:11:00]

Which is quite strange, because I've always gone into an architectural practice physically. And that's what I'm talking about now, all this physical stuff. It's still good to have that mind for it, because you need to be, especially in architecture, you're going to be, they might even ask you, for instance, on the first few days to go somewhere on site.

So you still need to have all this kit we're on about. You still need to get They're still handy to have the books around. Don't worry about the resources, it's still handy to get all the clothes so you feel professional. And even when you start work, I would definitely, one top tip, today I'm wearing a t shirt because it's boiling.

The thing is that when you're working, you almost want to, you always want to be, you almost want to wear professional work professional clothes, sorry, and even when you're working digitally, because there's something about your mindset when you're working at home, and if you're dressing a fit In your work attire, and if you dress professional, you're conditioning your mind to respond in a certain way.

They, so a company, you definitely should ask beforehand, Sona, if you are to reuse your own laptop. You need to talk about the [00:12:00] IT. So right now, you might have the computer, a laptop being sent by, to you. They might ask you to use your own. It can vary based upon the company. Because some companies will have their own.

Intranet is That's word or more about a Citrix buy, you know where it's like the closed area? Like a fi, yeah, like a firewall access. So they might want their own laptops, they might have their own AutoCAD licenses. Or it could be that you are expected to have a set yourself. So we are all working on our laptops at the moment, but it could have been the other way where.

you need to provide your own. This is definitely worth asking because what you don't want to be caught out with is you don't want to start and they go, Oh, do you not have your own laptop? And then you're in this kind of in between zone and you can't really start yet. And that's quite important.

You need to find out what time you're starting. So in the old days, pre COVID, [00:13:00] You would normally agree a time to start, it usually would be an hour or two after the start of the day. So it'd be like say, Stephen Drew's awesome architectural practice, super amazing company opens up at nine.

Then you'd probably find that you start at 10 o'clock and that's purely so they can get the IT systems. And it could even be the same in this way, where they need to clear you into the system. So you need to ask what time you're starting, you need to get all the details of ready. Because if you're going to be sending the HR and you're password digital, you still need to do that.

It's definitely worth finding out what software you're going to be using and how it would work. Because for instance, with Revit, some architectural practices, you will almost be like TeamVue, you will be Using a virtual computer, which is emulated from the distance, or you might find that you're actually using BIM live on your computer.

Granny's laptop is not going to be able to handle Revit. Whereas Jack Moran's super gaming [00:14:00] computer with his 144Hz monitor is definitely going to be able to handle the BIM model. So it's really worth finding out now. I think it's also,

Will Ridgway: sorry Steve as well, if you do have your own laptop, if they ask you, if you are working remotely, and they do ask you to use your own laptop, it's important to find out what software you need to have on that laptop already, so whether they need Revit for example, if you need to have Revit installed, and how you get that installed as well, because that'll, probably give you the license for that so you have to set that up yourself.

You'll also obviously need InDesign, other programs as well that might be regularly used, so it's important to find out which ones you need. You need on a laptop if you're using your own one so that you can get it installed and also make sure that your laptop can run it as well as Steve mentioned earlier.

So that's the that's important, but on the whole, I think they'll probably give you your own laptops for most studios, would they?

Stephen Drew: Yeah, I think you'll find that a lot do. Sometimes they will, if you already have your own, they might just say you can have a laptop. If you have your own, that's better spec, then [00:15:00] maybe you can use that.

Probably good to talk about licensing actually, because It's popped up actually one or two times on the Architecture Social where people talk about how do you get AutoCAD license for free. Now AutoCAD licenses and even Adobe I think are usually available to students. Back when I was studying in the olden days we didn't even have that so you'd have to know someone who would download one and you know it was a bit of a dodgy key and you had to put it in right and hey you're learning so it's not that particularly important.

Autodesk is not going to come. Knocking on a student's door who wants to study an architecture over that. It's very unlikely. What you've got to remember though, now you're in a commercial world and commercial projects, right? That it's all about making money and the thing is the When an architectural practice, which in essence is a business, is running for commercial profit, if you're using software which is not licensed and they're aware of [00:16:00] it, then that's not good because an architectural practice should not be okay with that.

But Especially I remember once I had my laptop I brought in one day and when I was at EPR and it had an old Photoshop license and then I just used it at the time and it was all cracked. And the thing is was that the output, the drawings I had was in that and then later I didn't feel comfortable and then I remember the time the director saying to me like, look, Never ever do that again.

I know your computer is a lot faster. You let me know and we'll get you a faster computer. And that's what they did. They gave me a bit of a faster computer. But the thing is from that is that if it got out or for instance if Microsoft does a scam and if there's anything illegal because you get These companies get a lot of inspections, then you're in a lot of trouble or you put them in the employers into a lot of trouble, which therefore makes you in this precarious, stressful world.

So you definitely don't want to use pirated software for an architectural practice. What you do in your own time. is a [00:17:00] bit different and that's not such a problem. It's more about drawings being made, which are published, which are being used in illegitimate software. Or if Autodesk comes in and does a scan and your website's got loads of cracks in there, that's probably not good.

So find out. So it's a good question. So you're going to find out about the licensing. You're going to find out about the computer. You're going to get your nice clothes ready so that you're Ship shape and shop ready to start looking good. And you're going to get one or two handy resources. You want to look at books or resources in particular that are helpful more, I'd say on the technical construction side, because that's the bit that's quite struggling.

And then you also maybe want to get one, invest in one or two. Things about the software that you're going to use. So you might get a master in Revit book. And then I would personally get a pocket handbook, which says all of the [00:18:00] architectural little tidbits, sizes of doors. You want to learn stuff like how big the opening should be accessible for wheelchair users.

That's what I would do. I remember when I was in architecture practice, spent ages going over floor plans, making sure that certain accessible flats would fit the right size, and there's certain books like this, which will have this information. Stuff like, what is the dimensions of a brick? Oh, I've forgotten now, so that's not very good, but the book would say.

Jack Moran: I can ask you Stephen, as well. Yeah. But what, because you've, you've actually been there and done that in terms of the practice for a lot of, the graduates or people who are going, what can they expect, like on a first day in terms of what's the actual work like on that first day?

Stephen Drew: Okay, good question. So you basically are probably quite nervous on the first day. Base this on me. You're like, oh, here we go. And it's like your big day out and then you go. And so at the time at [00:19:00] EPR, what I started and you we met in the boardroom and then I was lucky that I started with one of the two or three part ones who are now really, they were really close friends with them and we kept in contact.

So you can make friends doing this. And this is the point when you go there, you need to make an effort to make friends. That's the number one thing I would like to take away from it, because it's the same thing about what we talk about in architecture social as a community. The fact is friends can then later in your careers become successful.

You start helping each other out and you build rapport and it's quite nice not to do it alone. And even in the short term, when you go and start, so when I joined, You, I was in the room of food part ones and then during lunchtime, you sheepishly go should we have a sandwich down the road? And then you go and you go to Greg's or what have you and you talk about where did you get up to?

Oh, I had to sign these forms and you have you basically you do it with other people I mean if you're in the small architectural practice and you're there at the start You're gonna feel a bit scared maybe to ask a few people but maybe [00:20:00] ask the person that you're next to What are you up to at lunch?

That's what I would try to get, so encourage someone to do on their first day, is to ask someone out for lunch. That would be the good big thing. So I think that's really nice, because what we're all about is like building up a community, building up friendship, and that's what makes the whole year way more fun.

Way way done. If you're a part 1, you've got to be brave and ask the person next to you who's not if you wanna go out for lunch, they probably will say yes, and if you've got other part 1 starting with you, then you go out for lunch with them together. As a part 1, if you've never done it before, you're gonna join, you're gonna, you're gonna go in the morning, They're going to say probably you're going to be in a little meeting room for a little bit and normally HR will ask you to fill out a few forms.

They will ask you for health and safety, contact details, so who to ring, like Auntie Doreen. If you suddenly have a little accident, if you spill a few cups of [00:21:00] coffee or something, you burn yourself, who rings and all this stuff. So they take down your contact details, they take down your next of kin. They will probably ask for your passport, all this stuff.

Then you will usually go upstairs. at 10 o'clock, something like that. So the architecture practice, you'll meet the team. Now, if you've done this a few times, you're not going to be so nervous, further in your career, and there's going to be more cases. You meet everyone, you shake their hands you tell them a little bit about yourself, and then they're going to brief you on the project.

And it's not too far away in architecture. So when I, in part one, when I was a part one, you join, And then once it's low, then normally one or two of the directors will brief you on the project. They will let you know what stage the project's at, where it's at, and you'd probably be given a very little task.

They might even say, read the book right now of where the project's at. They might say, You should need to fill out, you need to do a little drawing or they might give you a little task. And what you'll find out is while you've got given this task, you'll have the IT [00:22:00] manager come over to you and ask you for your chairs and the right size fits and all this stuff.

And you will do, you will All these little tasks, while you do it, you start learning the project. Normally, you'll have baby steps into it, where you will be introduced to the project, and you learn by little tasks, and by the end of the week, you'll probably jump on board. If you want to do more normal tasks, it always looks quite good to do some extra stuff.

Definitely be keen, be in, and improve things, and do it. Just be respectful. So whenever you've done a task, that's the other thing I learned. If you've done a task, let them know in a nice way that you've done the task. You don't need to be too pushy and be like, Hey, I've done the task. But at the same time, if you've done the task, don't sit there until the end of the day and then go, Oh, I did that at 11.

Make yourself useful. Say, I've done that, is there anything else I can do? Can I get you a cup of coffee? And so at the time, I remember, they used to call me sometimes T [00:23:00] boy, because I'd always, I like to go to the kitchen, but I like to go for a chat sometimes. Yeah, but then

Jack Moran: if they do it once, then they're always going to be known as the T boy.

No, Jack, that's just, that's the reason

Stephen Drew: you never give me tea, and that's your excuse. Exactly, yeah, so now I never give you one. Yeah, you never give me a tea, but I used to give them a tea, and then, no, but they like it, everyone likes it now and then. But you're not going to be tea. Mr. T. But it depends on Mr.

T, right? Because I'm Billy the Bull. Give me a cup of tea, right? Get the cup of tea. Give them, be nice, just offer it. Or what you'll find, maybe this would be a little bit less be more friendly to you, Jack Brown. If you ask them if they need any drawings printed and stuff like that, because you can learn from that.

And so in architecture you've got to go, do you know how many hours I spend at the printer? You've got to make a good friend with that printer. Because you've got to go down there, you've got to learn how to fold things, you've got to learn how to use Scale Ruler. Definitely, you should be given stuff like Scale Rulers and pens, but it's definitely worth having.

It's really important to understand scale. I remember when I was a part one, I was quite chuffed because [00:24:00] I always made sure that the drawings were to scale. I always tell the architect for the meeting, I was like, this one's 120, this one's 1200. I remember once a part three went in and printed a bunch of drawings, they went to scale and all the architect's face Because he was in a meeting with a client and he wasn't happy.

Because the whole point of an architectural drawing is that you need to scale it to a ruler so that they can take a correct dimension off it. And if you don't have that, then they can't work out in the meeting. So if someone's saying, how big is that door? Is it one meter? Is it two meters? Is there a gap on there?

Surely it needs to be three meters, and then they pull out a ruler, and if you don't have that at the time, you're going to be into trouble.

Jack Moran: I reckon that's quite a big worry, for a lot of people going in on the first day. They're probably worried they're going to get like a really difficult task.

Tell us this bit more and show us everything that's wrong

Will Ridgway: with it. Yeah, you'll be gradually eased into everything. They're not going to expect you to suddenly run with a project as a part one. You're like, just be brief on the project, now run with it. They, they'll ease you in gently.

And [00:25:00] I think that's also important as well to manage your expectations. So you're not necessarily going to be going full throttle straight away. You've got to get through all these projects. For example you they'll, you probably have an idea already from the interview, because they've told you what kind of role they would like you to be in.

And then once you join on the day, then it'll give you a better idea of what to expect. And if you're a part one, you've got to think of it as more as, It's a big learning curve for you. So there's lots of steps for you to, learn from. It's going to be less, less about, obviously you'll still be producing drawings and everything, but it's going to be more learning for you as opposed to doing, if that makes sense.

I'm not really sure if I'm making sense there.

Stephen Drew: No, you are. Look, they've hired you because they've seen ability in what you've done. When you're a part one, you're not expected to come in and get the The formula to all the answers and what have you. What they want is for you to assist on the project and so a good part one is someone that contributes ideas when appropriate.

So we do want to hear that. [00:26:00] Good part one is someone that contributes ideas. What another good part one is someone that can take a task on and learn. And sometimes I think someone that will ask a few questions such as, what should I do here? How should I do it? Where should I do it? And then goes off and does it.

That's the ideal. That's the ideal thing. You're not expected. No one's going to say to you, okay, do the detail for the roof area. And because it doesn't work like that, you'll get briefed and they'll say, look, we need to do a certain detail for the roof, because this one's important, because what it does is it says the juncture of when it goes from this bit to that bit, and so I want you to have a little look at a few of the ones we've done before, have a little look at how technical drawings are detailed, here's a book for it, and then when you have a go at it, that's the kind of thing you're expecting, or it could be the other way where they say, okay, Can you do a free model and stuff that they give to me in my part one?

I loved it. It's my favorite [00:27:00] bit. So I do concept models and really cool stuff and then I'd be doing all the Photoshop. I've got some of them at the moment. So they're on my website. The thing is though, we're gonna What I'm going to do is I'll put all of some of them projects on because what I'm going to roll out soon is a nice little function on the Architecture Social where we can showcase projects.

And this is it, right? So when I was in industry, we did this really nice atmospheric stuff. And so it depends. So with me, I, they would be very, Particular about technical detailing. Cause that really wasn't my strength and they tell me what to do. But then with other stuff 3D modeling, I was really good.

I was probably like the top three in the whole company. It was like two, there's a proper visualizer who was amazing. Then you had one guy who was really good, but then what you'll find is a lot of architects, when they get old favorite in their careers, they will not be doing stuff. Visualization as much anymore.

So you are the part, one of the one that helps 'em. So I was doing a lot of that stuff and I loved it. And they absolutely loved the fact that I [00:28:00] knew software, they didn't, and then they could bring me to the table. So then you had a really nice trade off between them teaching me technical stuff and then I would just whack out these ideas.

And I remember one, there was, so there was a client called Eve Oasis, and they were like, Tesla before Tesla won. So now I don't know where EVE Oasis is, but what it was a shop at the time and I was modeling there and they were like, what should we call it? And so it was electric cars. And the idea was you pop into a shop, you buy your tidbits, Jack, you go shopping.

And then I was like we're modeling it. And he was like, what would you call it? And I was like, why don't you call it stop and shop? This is cars. Stop the car, have a shop, charge it up, go. And he looked at me and he was like. You're a genius. I remember feeling so good about it. I was like, yeah, I invented Stop and Shop, and all the videos had Stop and Shop.

And right, okay, I'm not saying I designed the building. What it was nice was to contribute [00:29:00] to part of it. And that's the thing. So while we were talking about physical stuff, The best thing that you can take to the interview is your mindset. So if you buy clothes now, right? Even if you're working remotely right now as a professional, you are, it's like that quote from was it 30 Rock?

And you know the character that, what's the guy, what's the main guy's name? And he says something like, You should dress. The way the, in the role you want to be, not in the role you are at now. That's

Jack Moran: dress for the job you want, isn't it?

Stephen Drew: Yes. Okay. And it's the same thing of if you are pride, okay? It carries a lot of weight and so you wanna get psychologically pumped up 'cause you do deserve the job.

But it where in that nice little suit you feel all good, you're gonna go and give it your best. And the other thing is then you wanna make sure that you feel confident enough about the software that you're like, gosh, when I go there. I can drive the software without crashing the BIM model, okay? You don't need to be the Mr.

BIM [00:30:00] Manic Guru. It's handy if you do have a bit of that skill set, because you might find that, hey, they really need you a lot. You might be doing the BIM stuff, and you might find that you're really good at it. You want to get ready on the software. And then, when we run about with the books, is that the reason I'm saying you need to get these books and technical stuff is that When you're there, you feel like you know how to get the information and that is, and that's what an architect's about.

And that's what all my friends who say that, that didn't let party free say that's what an architect's about, is that you're not expected to know everything, but what you are expected, and it's a bit like in my job as a manager or anything, when problems come, you know where to find the information or you know how to deal with it.

So you'll go, Mr. Client, I don't know what to do right now. I don't know the answer right now. I'm going to research. I know where to get it. I'm going to get back to you. And In context of this, as a part one, when you get given a task, you feel like that if you don't know how to do it straight away, you can find a bit of the information, and you can ask the right questions.

Don't spend four hours going off on a tangent. [00:31:00] That's not what you want to do. But at the same time you, you want it, but So when I've managed people, if someone asks you a question every minute, I can't think about what I'm doing. And that can almost cause the whole team to crash. Because when you're leading a team, you're spurring things on and you've got a project and things can fall apart.

At the same time though, if someone doesn't ask a question and I go off and then I come back three hours later and the task has not been done, Then that can be a little bit frustrating because you think, Oh no, we've wasted so much time and Will Ridgway has done a million things the wrong way. I'm enjoying your experience.

No, you're pretty good.

Jack Moran: I just thought I would just do that to make you laugh. Before I joined, McDonald and Company as well, I remember being on LinkedIn reading articles about Just how to, how to do work and jobs. And they all said the most common mistake that people make in jobs is, what you just said, Stephen, trying to do a task, [00:32:00] knowing that they can't they don't understand something about it, but because of the fear of not wanting to annoy someone, or not wanting to come across as incompetent, they'll try and do it anyway, and then they'll always end up to Just produced like a worse result.

So like you said, yeah, don't be afraid to ask a question. Don't ask a question every 10 minutes. If I ask question Stephen, two questions within half an hour, I've already pushed it too far.

If I'm under pressure, right? I'll be like, Jack,

Stephen Drew: What is it?

Jack Moran: It's always better to ask a question though, isn't it? And take your time and do it right. Just don't be afraid to ask. It's your first day. You're not going to be expected to do

Will Ridgway: a million things. It's about striking the balance between using initiative and also asking questions, I think.

You don't want to use initiative too much in case your initiative is wrong for whatever reason. But certainly asking the questions helps point you in that direction. You ask help that way, and it's always worth as well, if the person you're asking help with is just always busy, ask the person next to you, the other person next to you, maybe someone on your team, see if they can [00:33:00] help, for example, and then that also helps you start conversing with them.

Stephen Drew: Look, and the other thing, while I talk about what Will said, if your initiative, it's fake taste, then there's a really good analogy with this, right? Look, one day when you've got all this experience, the reality is you're most likely going to be a very successful and accomplished architect. There's a big difference between, never feel stupid about not knowing it, and what you want to do is, you're not if you've been taught, And you keep making the mistake, then that's a different scenario.

When you haven't done something yet, okay, you make mistakes and things are going to happen. But what you're going to do is that over time, when you get more experience and more confidence, you make less mistakes, you do more stuff yourself autonomously. So don't have a panic attack on day three if you go, I don't know what I'm doing and I can't do it.

It will come with time. And so when it goes back to what Will and Jack were saying about questions, There's another art form is that If you can ask a question efficiently and clearly, that's [00:34:00] good as well. What you don't want in this, and we even find it in this, I'm always amazed when someone asks me a question and they insert a story and statement in there.

For example, so saying that I go, Jack, where is the families for this BIM model in the bathroom? I can't find it. Could you help me please? That's quite clear. Then you go, Steve, I'm busy. Give me five minutes. Cool. If I go, Jack, you're right. The thing is, I just load up the model and I've gone through it now.

And what's really good is that I've done three of the first sections and they were really good. And I did the doors and that was interesting. I messed things up at the start and I changed it. And so now I'm on the bathrooms and it's really interesting the kind of bathrooms we're using and then I'm like, Oh, and then you go on.

Oh, by the way, yeah. So what family should I use? Cause I use, do you see how long this is taking? I'm frustrating. So there's like this really nice thing. You've got to think of it like, it's like a Swiss Army knife. It's like a team. It's it's again, it's this conveyor belt of efficiency. [00:35:00] And so a really good team, over time, you develop a thing where, for instance, when we're working together now.

We know when to ask questions, when to not, when's important, when to make a call yourself, and also to do things. But that takes time, it's taken us a year to build that up. And where it comes from is getting in sync with people. Because also when you're in an office the interesting thing is we're human beings, right?

You can have someone who's absolutely amazing at technical drawings, and maybe they're quite difficult to speak to. Maybe they even sound quite rude. You might have someone That's quite charismatic and quickly impatient. I don't know who that is. And then you might get other people that are really, they were really clever.

They just don't have much time. And there's, you're going to get the whole range of stuff. Okay. And you've got to work out these personalities and you've got to gel yourself with the person. What you've got to remember is everyone, the ultimate goal You're always going to get one or two people in life [00:36:00] that are going to be a bit difficult, and that's part of life.

You've got to learn to work around them. That's just unfortunately the way it is. What you've got to remember though, most people are very good in good nature. They're going for the goal. And some people can almost seem quite impersonal. But what they're doing is they're making that building, they're making the project the best they can.

And I, I guarantee you, if you come in there with an attitude of trying to really help out on a project and assist and get stuff done, that will go noticed. And those are the people that as a part one, you'll get invited back for part two. And those are the people in the company, because what it's about is it's about your, you wanting to help, you wanted to get that project over the line.

And therefore that's when that kind of attitude. Who is, what's going to save you if you do one or two mistakes. The attitude that isn't going to go well is like when I was on about someone meandering or someone that is not really paying attention. Cause that, so what I like is people on my team is I like [00:37:00] people who are hungry for the opportunity, want to do better and are willing to listen.

That, that formula I can work with a lot. Where it gets difficult is. Defensive people. When you're trying to help someone out, you're going to explain a task to them. And so I'm thinking of myself as an employer and. Yeah, I always believe in the person's ability if I've really hired them, okay? Sometimes what we got to do is you're almost gonna get past your ego on things.

And if some things you almost, maybe you feel a little bit insecure, you might feel in your head that the person is talking to you and you don't really know the stuff and it almost seems condescending. No one should talk to you in a bad manner. But what I'm on about is, if I tell you, That's wrong.

We need to do that. And this time you want to check this quicker. Check that. Remember, it's not personal. It's about doing it the right way. Now, if an employer is talking to you in a [00:38:00] derogatory sense, saying like, why did you do this? Are you stupid? Then that's wrong. And I personally think that is an attitude of someone unprofessional.

And I would question whether I want to work that company a long term. But my thing is that if you get something wrong, it could be like, come on, You can do this better. I've seen you do it better. And then that's the kind of thing, it's like coaching, it's like that whole thing. But to do that, to be coached the right way, you need to bring it as well.

And so that's what I mean it's like the coach thing in, in the sports. It's as long as you keep going and there's that energy then the employer can work with that. And so if you go to a job, starting this job with this appetite, Then that would be great. If you literally go in there to clock stop and not learn, it might be enough to me, if you're an employer and someone was above and beyond, but when I say above and beyond, I don't mean work until one o'clock every night, what I'm on about above and beyond is doing the [00:39:00] tasks efficiently and sensibly over time and adapting.

And when you've made a mistake, you learn from it, you take it on board, you acknowledge it's your mistake, but you don't condemn yourself for the mistake. You go, you don't lie. I messed up. I should have been more thorough. Next time I will do that. You don't go, I can't do it, and the employer shouldn't as well.

Where it goes wrong, though, is if an employer has told you something and you consistently do the mistake. And it's a bit like you're not at home. It's hello, please help me. Can you just listen? And that's the thing where that can be concerning, because what happens down the line is that if you're not paying attention and then if you're not paying attention, you let stuff slip.

And when stuff slip, then it can put you in a predicament. So there is an easy way not to do this though. And the way is to always pay attention, always listen. Don't go into an office and wear your headphones, because yeah, if you do a [00:40:00] task and it's boring, you're going to be tempted to put on the headset.

The thing is though, you're not learning, you're not learning subliminally of other stuff. And it's the same thing my architectural practice there at EPR, they encourage people not to go on headphones unless you were literally in the rendering corner for ages, because you learn stuff about the project, you learn stuff about what's going on.

And it's the same thing on my team. is that I'm not a big fan of headphones because You soak so much information from the people around you that it's helpful. And also, you're more likely to build friendships, and you have banter. And you can't really have banter if you're listening to Radio 1. You need to be in the room, you need to be present, and sometimes you can be a bit too loud.

You can get distracted by banter. I'm the worst person at that. I think I've distracted you guys a few times. It's probably not the best. It's character building because when you go above and beyond my distractions, I know I can. It's because

Will Ridgway: we put on

Stephen Drew: headphones. [00:41:00] Do you know what I mean though? What I'm trying to get at is that then we have to know each other, we have jokes, we get along.

And I think if we're all on the headsets, then you can't even do that. And it's even now. When we were, the reasons why we can openly talk about this stuff is because we all know each other, there's no awkwardness because of intense amount of times under pressure, when you've got to go into the zone, and then you have times for laughs and banter.

Will Ridgway: Yeah, I think headphones can be a bit of a barrier, because if you're wearing headphones, then you can't talk. People are less likely to come up to you to say hello, on your first day, for example, because you look like you're to yourself, for example. Whereas if you haven't got them on, you're suddenly more open to be approached.

And also you can listen to everyone. For example, you might hear some chatting or someone talking about the latest show last night that you watched, you'd be like, oh yeah, I watched that. And you can bond that way and actually make friendships that way. So it's important to, be aware of your surroundings, listen and that's how you get along with people and the more people you get along with.

The more

Stephen Drew: enjoyable it is to work there as well, I think. Do you know what's interesting? When I was hearing us [00:42:00] talk about this now, I'm like, how it's gonna, in this digital world, I tell you what, because, again, I flip back to the physical best, imagine this in an office, and the thing is, though, you need, this stuff is still applicable for an office, and actually, what you find a lot of architectural practices right now are talking about going back to the office, and there is going to be a split of being in the office, and then there's going to be a split of working digitally, so the same thing needs to be that You need to ask the right questions.

and make yourself available. And you need to basically, when, for instance, you're working digitally online, you need to still contact people who your team leader is at the right moment. We do it organically here. That's probably the best way to talk about it. The good thing about working remotely is that sometimes you get a bit more time to concentrate.

The downside is that things can slip. And if you don't have a morning meeting, or you don't have these kind of community aspects, then you can start to feel [00:43:00] isolated. The worst thing you do is you don't want to start being a part one. But get stranded at home and doesn't do much. You really need to fight to make sure that you've got enough work to work on, so that you're secure, your job's secure, and you're learning, without being too fussy.

You don't want to be ringing the person all the time. Maybe there'll be a function where you can drop messages on the system, and maybe there's a mess thing where you can say, can we have a catch up on Period of time. So what I would do is I would work on a task and I would say I have finished sections one or two.

They are ready for review. Can we talk at 1130 about this, review it, and next steps? Yeah. And they go, can't do that. I can do 1145. Good stop. So you being involved, you keeping them up to date. That is an efficient worker. What you don't want to do is just go home and then Start thinking, oh, do I say something?

Do I not? And then you're twiddling your thumbs, you're hanging around by the washing machine, and yeah, again, when you're working at home, try not to let other stuff bleed into [00:44:00] it, because I struggle with it at first as well, because when you're at home, you're like, this is brilliant, I'm going to do the cleaning while I'm on the phone, and you do get all distracted.

Nuh you've got to, you've got to imagine right now that you are physically in the office in your digital world, because that's going to be the best way you're going to become a best employee right now. So you're going to need to make sure the room's quiet, make sure you're available, make sure the internet works.

Gosh, that's a good one to do before you're in because right now you need to make sure that you're on, what you don't want to do is start the day and then you go. My internet can't handle certain things. That's going to be an absolute nightmare right now. Because you need to be onboarded digitally as physically.

And then as well as that, you do need to have this attitude of being made to be available physically at the drop of a hat. So get a travel card ready that you can top up on the go. Use your debit card if you're in London. And if someone says, do you want to go with the site? You basically say yes.

Because I tell you what, if I hire someone and they go, I can't really [00:45:00] do that day because it's not convenient for me, can we do it next week? I'll be like, what? You're starting with me. You need to make yourself accessible. And and when I say that, I'm not one about going knee deep into the coronavirus territory of death.

What I'm one about is, if something sounds sensible, like the office has a coronavirus office. Plan, which they should all legally have, and you have allocated times and days to go there, or more likely, you're going to go visit an architectural practice. You're going to see something on site, then you need to make sure that you can go there.

You need to make sure you have a mask. That's going to be a good one right now. You're going to have your little mask. Am I going here? There we go. You're going to get out your little mask. You're going to put it on like Angela Gretel. You're going to look like the mask murderer and get yourself ready.

The worst thing, can you imagine if you start somewhere and you go, I can't go because I haven't got a mask, that would be a faux pas. So get your mask ready, get all your stuff, get your kit ready. So maybe what we should do now is [00:46:00] let's summarize things, but let's summarize it in, before starting the job, digital and physical, on the day starting physical and digital, and then things to do during physical and digital.

Going there, digitally, is, before you go, have you got your computer set up? Have you asked how the software should be? Have you asked, have you made sure that you've got headsets that work, you've got a camera so everyone can see your beautiful face, and have you made sure that you've got everything?

Does the software work? Do you need to bring your own laptop? Have you asked that you're going to be there digitally? And they ask what, and ask what time it's going to start. Physically, if you're going to go to the office, get your mask, go to the shop, get your suit, get your thing. You're going to get your suit anyways because you need to digitally look like you.

a pro. You're not going to be there in a shirt with stains and in a really [00:47:00] unflattering pose. You're going to, you're going to look professional. You're going to be all, you're going to be all crisp and cream. You're going to get your clothes physically. You're going to go buy books on Amazon, digital books, physical book.

You're going to look at Books, which were designed for students to start. The one that immediately comes to mind is the Architect's Pocket Handbook, stuff like that. You want to get websites, you wanna go onto communities like the architecture, social, and ask, Hey, the what, pe what do people use right now?

Which is really handy. So there's a particular lady that I'm gonna be doing a podcast with in, in Australia who runs my first architecture job. which is all about this. So it's going to be interesting to see what that course is about. Stuff like that, right? You really want to be looking at her course.

I think it's her name is Sarah Lebner. Check it out online. And it seems really great. It's all about the detail and stuff that, because I'm, I understand the recruitment process and I've done [00:48:00] architecture. She is going to be an expert on technical drawing and all this stuff. So you want to look at courses like that.

You want to learn, you want to speak to people. You've listened to our opinion. Ask people who were part ones from before, how they started as well. Okay. Preparation before, and you're going to ask the company before you go there. What you need to prepare, you're going to bring them up and you're going to say, do I need the software?

Is there anything you'd like me to learn? Any reading, any information like that? On your start day, you're going to find out if you start there digitally or physically, you're going to find out what time you start. You're going to get all your paperwork, your passport, your bank. Details. You can do it as efficiently as possible, and you are going to meet your team, and you're going to try and bond with them.

If you can't physically go out for lunch with everyone, ugh, that is frustrating. Depends on what I was talking about earlier, but definitely, maybe what you want to do is You need to find a way that you can socialize with these people and, maybe you'll find that [00:49:00] you'll have team drinks at the end of the thing.

Definitely do any social events on the architectural practice and you don't want to go in there and get absolutely hammered if it's a drinking event and be known as that guy because no one likes to be that guy. And it's not good if I'm the hiring manager and I've hired someone and the person on my team is the guy that did loads of inappropriate stuff.

Everyone can get a bit drunk sometimes, but what you want to do is make a good first impression. But you do want to get involved and have a beer or a glass of champagne. You want to get to know people. And maybe what you could do is if it's digitally, the team leader that you join is that you could say something like, look, I'm going to crack on for the day.

Maybe what we could do is I could bring you. I'd lunch for 10 15 minutes to hear your advice or feedback on stuff, or maybe we can have a bite over lunch together. That would be quite, I'd quite like that if I started with another part one. Find out the other part ones you start at the same time, and then what, try to have a friendship circuit, like the breakfast club, where you're all sitting down and getting [00:50:00] along with each other.

Okay, so what other things have we got to mention to start the day?

Jack Moran: Yeah, so we've done the start day, we've gone through the first, we're arriving on the first day, haven't we, and we're just going to bring back any workload that was to be expected of you. I thought, we had a question come in, which I thought would be a nice little round up, and it's definitely one for you, Stephen.

A bit of a nostalgic question. Is there anything you regret not doing during your Part 1? That's a

Stephen Drew: million dollar question, isn't it? I had a really good part one probably would have pushed the technical aspects more. So I was never that good at it. And what I did is that I got a lot better at architectural visualization, which was great.

The thing is though, that was what I was already good at. So it's like I put my best skill up and I was very basic and technical detail in. Okay, and therefore I could have improved [00:51:00] that more doing that. So when I went to Part 2, I would have built up on it a bit more and then when I started my Part 2, it would have been stronger.

And then when I come back, I'd be even stronger. And so what I did is I ignored. What I thought was a weakness in order to build up a strength. And that worked a little bit in my part two, because I became the expert on doing part one drawings, bashing stuff out, doing 3D models. And I had it down that basically in MicroStation, because everyone was rendering in SketchUp and all this stuff and Revit, we were moving to Revit.

And basically I was taking MicroStation models and I made it render in the software without any plugins on any computer. So I optimized the process that any. Basically, a computer could knock out an image really quickly, so this was no magnum opus. But what it was, is that you could bash something out.

And the point is, I was really proud of that. The thing was, though, is that when someone then needed me for a technical drawing, that didn't matter. And while I optimized the process, [00:52:00] I wasn't an all rounder, and that's something I learned deeply, and that's something that, at the time, I regret, but now, that's why, even in recruitment what I always talk about with you guys is that while I'm good in certain things, what I make sure is that I'm good throughout, I'm comfortable throughout the process, whereas some people are exceptional at one bit.

What I like is that in recruitment, I, in my job now, I can take a brief or a role for an inception or get a role and carry it across the line. And that makes me feel a lot stronger. Whereas in architecture, what I'm trying to say, Jack, is because I didn't push the bits that I wasn't comfortable with, I became an expert in one area.

And the danger is with that, it's good to specialize into one area. A certain sector or two,

Jack Moran: so yeah,

Stephen Drew: What you want to do is make sure that you're versatile throughout the process, because what happens is in the industry is that if you just worked on overseas buildings at front end stages, it's really hard to get you a job on a London scheme on technical [00:53:00] stages.

So that's my thing is that push the areas in part one you're not comfortable with.

Will Ridgway: Yeah,

Stephen Drew: to become better. And all this stuff we're talking about is to get you in the right mindset to learn and for you to feel confident. Remember, they've hired you because they see inability and strength and you're not expected to know everything.

You're expected to bring maybe one or two little ideas like this. Technical tidbits. You're on software and stuff, but what they're expecting you to do is someone that you're someone they believe in that they can give instructions and that you're going to learn. You're going to ask appropriate questions.

You're not going to ask too much. You're not going to ask too little. You're going to help out. Above all, they're looking for someone. They've hired you because they want you to be part of the team. Get stuck in the project and get going and that's the thing. Push yourself on the bits you're not comfortable with.

Go the extra mile. It will get noticed and you will feel better for it. That doesn't mean working in eight hours and being pushed over. I'm on about a respectful team. You getting [00:54:00] involved and wanting to be the best you can. to help the project out.

Jack Moran: Brilliant. Anything from your side, Will?

Will Ridgway: Nah, that was pretty well done, really.

I think it's just all about having the right attitude, in my opinion. If you've got the right working attitude, you'll do alright, because it'll be seen. And not only will you do well, but you'll get recognised, and it'll just improve your overall experience. And I think it's just all about, you're not expected to know everything.

You're there to learn. And they, they believe that, You add to the team, so you're there for a good reason, really. So it's just all about doing well, do some work behind the scenes if you want to help you improve your learning and then also ask, help you ask relevant questions, and actually help contribute ideas to the team.

If you're helpful, it will be really appreciative. Yeah,

Stephen Drew: big time. But said, and remember, you don't need to do it alone. Even if you go into different practices, make friends with part ones, part twos, architects who are starting in companies, learn from each other. How did this company set up? How did that company set up?

And it goes back [00:55:00] to the community. So the best thing about the Architectural Socialist community is we all learn from each other. People who started the year before, people who started then, and when part one's finished in an architectural practice, They're just about to finish and you're about to start.

So I remember when that happens, I would always try to go for lunch for the part one and make them feel comfortable, make them feel at home. We have this opportunity here on the Architecture Social as well as your architectural practice. The people that get involved more, share ideas, share experiences.

They are the leaders of tomorrow. So be active in your community and learn from each other and don't worry about it. You can do this and you will have a fun time. Well done on your job.

Jack Moran: I think that wraps up everything for this week. So thank you everyone for joining us. We hope you enjoy the rest of the week and we will see you same time next week for our next episode.

Stephen Drew: All right. Thank you everyone. Take care. Bye. I'm going to turn my fans on now. Woo. See you later.