The IMPACT of AI within the Architecture Profession, ft. Nathalie Rozencwajg at NAME Architecture

The IMPACT of AI within the Architecture Profession, ft. Nathalie Roz
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The IMPACT of AI within the Architecture Profession, ft. Nathalie Rozencwajg at NAME Architecture: Hello everyone now at the Ready Computer at the Ready Chat, G P t at the ready. Don't worry this isn't scripted yet. I'll have to wait for my AI actor to come in till then. No, it is me Mid journey. The ready, choke, be live or would be revealed. 10 seconds. Whoop. That's not true. 15. Whoops. All right. Okay.

Five seconds. Get that pret sandwich ready.

Hello everyone. It's Thursday. We're almost at the end of the week, but I have a super exciting episode, which I can't wait to get into. And without further ado, no scripts, no chat, g p T around just yet. This is unscripted, this is live, and I have [00:01:00] the fantastic Natalie, the founder and director of name Architecture.

How are you today, Natalie? Great. Great. Thanks for having me. Briefly last year at the London Build Expo where we talked a little bit about what name Architecture does, but we also have a little bit of a topic today, which I find really interesting because you're, you are a practicing Architect. You are a director of this kick ass Architecture practice, and you've been experimenting with ai and I can't wait to hear about it all.

But just before we go into ai, for anyone that's not met you before, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and name? Great. Yeah. The practice is called the name Architecture. I'm Natalie Rosen, spike, the founder and director of the practice. We we work from offices in Paris, in London, although today the biggest team is in is in Paris.

And that's where I'm talking to you from today. I set name up about five years ago after a 12 year partnership. [00:02:00] And we've actually quickly grown into a great team of like-minded. People who enjoy the variety of projects that we do in the office. We have projects in many different cultures, in many different scales.

And and so it's really a kind of studio that shares this as a, as both work, but also in a very studio like environment. I think what the, what's important to say in the contexts in the context of our talk today is that one very important aspect for us is to sim seamlessly mix this production of the work that we do for clients with the larger questions that interest us and we use.

We try to use every opportunity that we get to question something, to advance our knowledge and and to highlight the conceptual thinking that goes behind it. In the context of our discussion today, these are very important and interesting questions that we're tackling in the office as a studio.

Very cool. I brought up. The link here and people can check out name Architecture, but don't get too distracted with all that beautiful work because you can ask [00:03:00] Natalie live questions as well, and Natalie has made. This is so super easy and interesting because I've got a series of questions.

That we thought we'd talk about in the AI space as well, themed around what we're gonna talk about. My goodness though, we've got so many hellos, but we're definitely live Natalie because Oh, they're all coming in, which is quite nice. Perfect. So what I'm curious about as well, is, so as a practice in Architecture, you're the founder of the studio.

So why are you interested in AI at the moment? So I think it's obviously not something that we can not be interested in or not look at, into because it's all around us and it's it's affecting all the industries around us. So it's actually something that we've started questioning a few years ago already, when the first Instances appeared in, in, in the profession.

And I guess our larger question is how is it gonna affect our profession as we know it today, which [00:04:00] is also, yeah. I'll come back to that. Not necessarily something that has always been, and our profession is constantly evolving, but I'm interested mainly to question whether is this really a paradigm shift?

And how how to prepare ourselves for this or how best to work with it. I think there are interesting questions that will come along probably in the talk is how are we also actors of this change and not just. Something that is going to happen and fall on us and we're not prepared for this.

So that's, in a nutshell why we're interested in it. I have to add to this, that I'm interested in it both. I've. I've taught for 12 years at the AA in London, and we'll come back to that as well. But I think one of the interesting questions here is both how it's gonna affect the profession, but also how does it affect what we teach the future architects.

And will Architecture still be taught the way we know it today? That those are inherent questions that come behind this. Very cool. And just to interject to this now, so [00:05:00] before this podcast, this episode, cause I was excited about it. I put out a question on LinkedIn where I said, how does everyone feel about the rise of AI chat, G P T, mid Journey being used within the Architecture industry?

And it was quite interesting. So 283 people voted, 39% of people said they're very optimistic. 36% said they're cautiously optimistic and it was 15% of people slightly con concerned and 10, 10% deeply concerned. Yeah. So I'm, I was encouraged by that. It did, yeah. Yeah, because it can go either way.

But like we touched upon it a little bit, Natalie, before this episode as well, where. We, no one, we're not saying it cuz it's early technology, yet we're an AI expert or any of like that. But it is interesting seeing how those things feed into it. But there's a question that you proposed as well.

About what can this be compared [00:06:00] to in the history of Architecture? Yes. So where can AI be compared to in the history of Architecture, in your opinion? I don't have a clear answer to that yet. We're questioning that, but I think the word Architect or Architecture is an old world, a word, obviously that comes from ancient Greek, but the profession as we know it today is relatively recent.

I think, app. Up to the Renaissance, for example, when the first uses of the word Architecture as a as a title to what we're doing is appears. Before that there was it was the creation or the imagination of these the buildings. Came either from an the artist where they, or the, some kind of creative thought behind it.

And then it was very much implemented by the person who knew how to build, who was the masons and the carpenters that built structures. It's in, in the Renaissance that we start seeing this appear as as a title. Not even a profession yet, but as a title and as. There's a certain number of rules that are set in books that people should follow.

And it's then only [00:07:00] actually much later in the 19th century that we start seeing with the Boza school in France, and then this decline worldwide. The profession starting to really be taught as such. And I think that's the, first of all, an interesting thing to, to bear in mind because what we.

Dema set in stone today as our profession of architects and how we practice it, how we teach it is relatively recent in the history of modern societies, although buildings existed for all the time. Yeah. That's an in interesting aspect. The other one is that I think it's always difficult to exactly.

Explain what our, what the profession of an Architect is. Is it, yeah. The creatively thinking about designs. Is it the drawing? Is it building? Is it the knowledge of knowing how to build? Is it the knowledge of regulations and it's all of this our profession is a generalist profession and it evolves and it has evolved over time with new technologies, with new building techniques drawing techniques as we all know.

What I think what's interesting to question now is what shift are we seeing and what [00:08:00] will happen with the future of this profession? There are, obviously, AI is a great tool and. We that is also I think, the direction that most Architecture practices are using it for the moment, as in it's a great tool for automating tasks for generating creative ideas and having that as a basis of discussion.

However where it's going to go and how much will it will it take over? What we're doing or what we're understanding an Architecture should be doing today is a question. Yeah. We're all working it out as we go, aren't we? I'm just gonna put a little bit of eye candy because I love your projects in the background, so thank you.

If you've got these beautiful projects, we may as well show them. But like you say, I think it's an interest in space. It is definitely a hot topic right now. I went to actually an exhibition last week. By hamster shake where he com, it combined traditional Architecture drawings with ai.

So it was like that [00:09:00] fusion, and I thought that was a really interesting space because it wasn't like a full blown mid journey AI drawing. But he took Ellen Elements from it and mixed old and new and I thought that was quite interesting. Natalie Lee, I think there, there's a lot of things to, to be said about it.

I think first of all I would maybe make a slight give slight explanation here or precision for our audiences. I think we. Could differentiate between AI as an automation, so anything that has to do with space planning the kind of result resolution at the level of massing of plants that is already actually quite evolved in, in the industry.

And what we've seen come coming up. Recently is the image production and the visual aspect of it with mid journey and so on. I think and in a sense, this novelty now is something that everyone is obviously talking and testing about because it's also quite easy to, to test and it's open to, yeah, to everyone.

Therefore, there is a question, of course, you don't need to be an Architect to to design buildings on mid [00:10:00] journey or to creatively come up with with ideas. So I think that it's important to make this. This distinction What's interesting here, if we talk about this, the aspect of the visual production in Architecture, as you said, is that it is very much based on what is already previously existing.

And we've seen, I think, a great evolution over the last months since. Mid journey made this big break into the social media of how this is constantly evolving in terms of st stylistically images that are produced and the actual quality of those images. So that, that it's really rapidly changing.

I think if you'll be listening to our PO podcasts in a month time, probably we'll be talking about old stuff already, but I make this distinction because I think it's an important one about how. What is our role as architects in these processes? I think that obviously the automation side of it, where we, where the AI is an assistant to to space planning is is a tool that is, has to be more controlled, where variables, the important elements in [00:11:00] them are the variables that you set.

Yeah. And that requires a certain level of let's say familiarity or knowledge with these. But it also has it, it poses questions of, who who inputs these variables. Is it you as an Architect or how, or if I take examples of developers and clients that, that the developer could actually.

Get quite far into this process of in, of coming up with a amassing for future sites without, before he actually contacts you as an Architect or the way what that ar the Architecture profession is organized today. So I think the questions that come on there is that what is our role in there?

What can we, what do we contribute to this to, to this. Process and I guess a lot of the people who are cautious about that, it also ask the question of how many architects will still be needed to when this automation process is very much improved. That, that's I think, one aspect that we can talk about and question.

Then there's [00:12:00] obviously the second aspect, which I call maybe the aesthetic aspect of the artificial intelligence, and it's the. The creation of images. What I find fascinating in in, in that and to question is what the process to actually create these images are because this is very much based on prompts today as we know it.

You create the image because of the prompts that you set in. And there's a whole kind of world in questions of what are these what are these prompts? What should they be? Who, who knows how to use the pro prompts correctly? Does do you, is it something that we should now learn or teach like to describe.

It's almost like the verbal description of an image becomes more important as an input than anything else at this stage. And there, there's questions of language as well. I think. I don't know if you've you've seen this, it was recently published, this test at which we actually. I'll talk about it in a second.

We, we, that did this in the o office too, but this test that was conducted about using the same prompt in different languages and the [00:13:00] a the image generated was quite different each time. Yeah. Cause of the cultural references that come along the way that a word is understood or not. So I think there's a whole.

Kinda interesting aspects in, in, in the kind of create creation of these visual images. Which also questions what our roles as architects with our background and with our education can bring to this. Yeah, said. It's it is fascinating. I've used Mid Journey myself and I think where I see there's a few business cases, so on the Architecture, Social online images, they can be copyrighted.

If you are generating something, there is no copyright with it. So there's This creative area of it. Yes. But like equally, like you said, you can be in like generate a building in the style of name Architecture, with Vray looking high res 4k. And it will do the best of its ability to do that.

But equally, as you say, based on the prompts, based on the order, based on all these keywords and how to [00:14:00] enter it, you get totally different stuff. Yes. But the other thing I think is really important to mention with. Chat, G P T, which has come out now. I was using AI last year before chat.

G P T took off. And it's been around for a while and I think one of the important bits to mention is, so this. This machine has sucked up all this language, which goes up to 2021, but it's not 2022 or 2023. So we have to be careful on what people understand this. This thing can be used. It's got not gonna know anything that's happened in the last two years.

But actually, like you say, it's really savvy. On even like earlier when we were talking about the history of Architecture, you can get some weird and wacky results mixing in name Architecture slash wick in a neoclassical style and it will generate something, which I find It's really inspirational.

I was gonna quickly ask you before, I don't wanna deviate away too much to the [00:15:00] questions, but where I could see it potentially doing really well is like that startup part of, in the design process in your office, you're on the front end stages. You just wanna get a feel for it.

Yes. I reckon it. It could be a really cool tool to spitball looks and feelings, further along, as you've done, you've got all these amazing buildings here that you've done over time throughout your career and stuff. A mid journey image is gonna give you that sense of feel, but that's far and away very different to building a building like you've done now.

Would do you agree with that? Would you experiment with it in the front end of designing? Yes. So first of all, to answer yes, for the moment, we are very much experi experimenting it in, on the front end. We take if we need to express an idea for a project, for a competition, it's we do it even internally for ourselves to see what it triggers and it for that it is a great tool.

You suddenly say, oh yeah I didn't imagine this. Yeah, it's almost. In, in a sense it's maybe not so different to what we were doing before when we were [00:16:00] collecting images on Pinterest and than just take, taking inspiration from these two. Ah, true. So it's just of course, exponentially more efficient and quick.

However, I have to say it's today, it produces images only. But I think it's a matter of time before we see it. Produce, translate these images into three-dimensional models or point clouds or whatever, three dimensional form that can be worked with. And from that, then start being the basis of the project that you work with.

So I think this. This will happen very quickly. We see it already happen in other industries, in animation industries where they, from the image they manage to make a an animated model out of it so that it's really a matter of time. In a way, when I'm thinking and asking these questions, I'm already considering this, that it will actually this evolution will happen and we're very quickly going to move from image to an actual three dimensional expression of it.

Then your question comes to who? Who knows how to build This is a question. [00:17:00] In itself. Like an image is an image. It's not it's not the knowledge of translating that image into first of all, documents that can, that can be built and to actually build it. Of course, yeah. Be streamlined as well with three 3D printing and all the tech, the technological evolutions of the build industry as well.

But I think that's really Very interesting questions as to, what the stages will be, who will be conducting them, but more than this, I would say, but what I'm interested in is, How when you are presented with options, because the tool is great to, to give you an array of options to look into, to, to consider, once you have these options, how do you make the decision of to pick that one above another?

I, I think and that's obviously, that's the mystery of the creative process. Process. It's very hard to explain what that means. Like why why and how we make these decisions as as creative people in general and as architects in our case. [00:18:00] And I think that, but that's the core of the question for me because it's what credentials or what experience will you have in the future or the future generations will have to make these decisions to take something forward and leave something behind.

Yeah. Yeah. Said. We're, and we have to see a little bit where it's going, isn't it? I'm not too wor, I personally am not too worried that AI is ever gonna replace the role of an Architect cause it's there's so much variables. There's so much knowledge and experience. Yeah. That being said, though, it could it is interesting seeing where, maybe AI can take away from those mundane tasks.

It's quite interesting. Like you mentioned, maybe Pinterest should be worried because all those mood boards are gonna go, cuz maybe we'll get them on mid journey, but hey. That's Pinterest it's actually, there's some interesting developing developments happening around that as well. Is that the, in a sense today, mid Journey takes, or all the, these AI tools take the images from a bank of images that is out there.

This is going developing [00:19:00] now towards the potential of you creating your own bank of images. Meaning that in the future it will, if we will I will be using this, these tools, for example, it will only take it from images that I have pre-selected or our website, for example, or and images that are similar to that.

So I will really be able to guide the AI into creating something that is, has the identity of name Architecture. Yeah, said. I tell you what, we've still been getting lovely messages coming in. Yo says hello to me, but loves your images, Natalie. So you know you have another fan internationally there.

They are good images. Ishka asks some really interesting questions, maybe partly I can get involved in as well as yourself, because talks about the Architecture profession, but also looking for a job as well. Ishka says hi Natalie. Like you mentioned, clients could also. Get sure far into the meeting process using Mid Journey.

Does the knowledge of mid journey make architects more [00:20:00] sought after from a client's perspective as well as from a job application perspective as well. So I'm happy to share my thoughts on the job perspective. Aspect, however, Natalie, what do you think about it from the client's perspective? These tools like Mid Journey?

Yeah I'm sure they will, and they are already in the same way that previously, some clients use SketchUp or similar types of software to, to design their own, their house or their project before they came to see you and tell you. Tell you, this is what I want. So I'm sure, yes.

And it's so democratic in a sense that people will be testing it a lot. I think it comes, this comes back also to the questions of what makes us particular as architects. I think, we are at present, at least educated for five years in school. What do we do during those five years that makes our use of these tools different to just anyone?

Else using it in the context of of developing a project and on a particular site. I think that's, to generate an image is [00:21:00] something, but to generate it with a particular intention and the many constraints that we have to take into account as as architects is a different process.

Yeah. Yeah. Different process of decision making along the way. Yeah. I agree with you and we, we touched upon it briefly before we went live in terms of the job application process. I haven't really seen it yet. I think yeah. Images on mid journey, whether they pop up in the CV, maybe as a student that could be one thing.

But where I see AI being amazingly useful is stuff like covering letters. Okay. When you're still gonna get the core bits of what you want to say in, but actually, I. I think that some people really like covering letters. I'm not too sure they're needed anymore. I, covering letters used to be went before email when you would send your application in and you would put the letter on the front and there's stuff like that.

You could probably speed up the process by. If you need a cover letter, okay, you [00:22:00] can generate it with inputs and then you can concentrate on making, of course, that portfolio beautiful. Yes. But, with, it goes a bit to like we're talking about in Architecture as an Architect, basically that feel of that document, that portfolio, it's your dna.

It's who you are, it's your qua, it's your taste as an Architect. And I don't think. That you can use AI to do that part of the CVN portfolio because the portfolio is, as cuz you've got your own studio, Natalie, when you go in for an interview, it's the conversation with the person, with the portfolio.

And if it was a generated portfolio, I think you would start to feel that in the interview, but maybe using it for a covering letter. It's not really a big deal. It's okay. Of course we, if we usually also just look very quickly at the covering letter and then look at the portfolio first.

And if the portfolio is interesting, we go back to the covering letter to see what is in [00:23:00] there. But no I totally agree. I think it's interesting what you're saying because I think actually and we're seeing this happen already with with the advent of. Chat, g p t as well. And in many educational environments where they're like suddenly taken over by the fact that all these students are writing essays that are auto automated quickly with the ai.

I think it's, there's an interesting question here of what will actually become valuable. Yes. Architecture students today can produce 10 renders for a jury in in about just the day before the jury and come and put them up on the wall and they might look good. As an image.

I think we will see and emphasize growing emphasize on actually talking, de describing your work, talk, presenting yourself, describing your intentions your concepts, because that is the only thing you know that. For the moment the AI is not doing is cannot replace replace you in physically.

Of course you can deep fake your interview and so on. But that's let's not go into that. But I think there, there's [00:24:00] certainly a, again, a value to the actual dis verbal description and verbal exchange of that is going to, we're going to see growing. Yeah I completely agree. So you maybe just answer, sorry, go on.

No, go ahead. Maybe just to answer your question about the interest of it in a, as a job application. I think definitely, any tool is interesting for for studios hiring, depending of course on the studio and what they're doing. But for a studio who's interested into adopting these tools, and I think.

Honestly speaking, it's everyone is going to have to somehow adapt to this because it'll just be otherwise you'll lose your competitiveness. But I think any tool that you can bring along and knowledge that you can bring along that. That can help the studio evolve. It's great. I'm we have recent graduates in the student studio that use, that teach me tools that I don't know and I didn't hear about.

And that's great because that, that triggers new kind of potentials and ideas and it's a very refreshing and interesting. Yeah. [00:25:00] I agree. And the last bit cuz I know we've got one or two questions more. The last bit I want to add is, the other thing is sometimes when you're designing the CVM portfolio, Okay, you can have a one, generic one, but let's say now I really want to work for name I might.

Do a bit of research on name and choreograph that se portfolio, two things that I think you would go, Ooh, that's interesting. Putting certain bits at the front, making a certain emphasis on parts of my research or or, and move the aesthetic slightly to something that would fit within named ecosystem studio.

And I don't think AI's there just yet to do it. Maybe one day it will eventually, yeah. Actually it's no, and you shouldn't yet take everything that the AI tells you as taken for granted because I was testing Chad g p t on asking. If if he knows name Architecture and what we designed.

And it was the response was quite interesting because it obviously went [00:26:00] to our website and took general sentences as a reply, but then also described us as having designed projects that we have that are not ours. It was quite interesting to know that we designed the hotel in Paris. Why not?

But Yeah, it's not you can't take it yet for for granted, because there are a lot of mistakes in it. Correct. Exactly. Cuz I've got part of the Architecture Social, not to deviate too far, but it fits exactly what you're saying is a directory. And I thought, cool. If chat g p t is super accurate, say now I want to talk about an Architecture practice like B P T W and name Architecture.

Great. I can generate a bio, people can still go to, wouldn't that be in Interesting And exactly like you said. It give me for, I tested it would B P T W and the dates were wrong and I wasn't sure if a building was there, but it equally it was quite convincing. So I was like, oh, it's if I didn't do that due diligence and took it as is, I would've posted that on the Architecture Social and it would've been [00:27:00] wrong.

And that's where. We're not there just yet. But and on last side note. Yeah. Which did you know Microsoft owned Chat gpt and they are, it, it's Bing is a search engine, which not many people use. Google has the lion's share, but it could be interesting that this AI technology might dero.

I'm not sure it but what I'm saying is it's the only thing so far. That will give Google a run for its money. And I do think though, with more basic Architecture and I want to use that word lightly, but maybe simpler tasks, I can see where AI would have a better stab at it. But when you're doing a amazing work, like this project that I know you're proud of often is on Instagram.

I don't think AI is gonna generate this, but maybe briefly while you're here. Can you just tell me a little bit about this cool project, because I know Yeah. It is recently, yeah, this was actually a reside, a [00:28:00] residential project on a very tight and constrained site that we design. So I have to say it's, this was not generated with the artificial intelligence as such, but it was used very much with parametric tools and some of them kind directed to.

To somehow use some of art artificial intelligence tools to make judgments, I would say to discard options and put forward other options in the design process. I think what was very interesting here is that it, it is actually as you can see, a simple module that is twisted along the vertical axis as it grows vertically and the in interesting why we like working like this is, first of all we like to set out a very strong conceptual thinking behind the project at the outset.

I, from experience, and first of all, that's the way I like to think and develop projects and also from experience while you work with the clients and develop the project. A strong concept enables you to keep the essence of the project alive. Despite [00:29:00] the many changes that will occur in during this design.

Here, what we, during the design process, we actually had to accommodate various change regulations that were either changing or that were given to us at a later stage of design. In terms of very technical issues of of watering risks and loads and so on. And the fact of that we had this parametric model built and and the variable set enabled us to reconfigure the design while taking into account these par parameters without completely over having to start from a blank page again.

So I think that's that's where as a practice we, we like adopting these new technologies and techniques because it, it is a tool that can definitely enhance the creative work and, but also really keep the original concept and idea progressing and alive. Yeah, I think it's really cool.

So I'm a bit biased. When you sent it through, I was like, Ooh, that is a nice. That is a beautiful building, but really interesting to hear your process [00:30:00] behind that and how it gets involved. Now I've got one or two wind down questions and if you fancy it, the last one before you get to ask me any questions, cuz we talked a bit about space planner, we talked a bit about aesthetics of ai.

Let's, but we talk, and also we were talking about CVS and portfolios, but in terms of. Academia, Architecture education, or you as an employer educating an Architectural Assistant, a young Architectural apprentice. How do you think Architecture is gonna be teach in the future? How are these tools are gonna be used and stuff?

Have you got any thoughts on that? Yes. A lot. No. A lot of thoughts. Not necessarily clear answers, but a lot of questions and directions of thought. I think, first of all I have to say, I think it teaching softwares is, for lack of a better word, or tick or tools and Architecture is always a question because you.

And it's balanced to find between how much that takes over and how much that influences the output [00:31:00] or how much you have to learn or without it. And it's a it's a very old question, right? We you remember the advent of cad, the discussions that are still going on, whether if in first years of Architecture you, you should use ca only pencil drawings or line or use computer at all.

And it's. It seems like an old fashioned question, but some schools actually still still ask or still have the particular rules around this. Then there was the big overhaul of parametric tools, of course. And then lately BIM tools in, in, in the, in, in Architecture. And do you teach BIM?

It's cool or not? What's the value of teaching and it's a real question that you come out of school and you don't it's a very rigid type of program, so it. You can, you could say it kills the creativity at the level of students. So you don't really teach them, but once they come out to the professional world, you're actually, as a professional employer, you want them to use it.

So where do you strike the balance? So I think this question ha is an ongoing question in the profession. I think also that Architecture as a profession is a profession that changes [00:32:00] slowly. Even if you look at the advent of BIM not all offices use it. It's, it has cultural differences.

I can see the differences between the UK and France, for example. It's very widespread in the UK today. It's still not as common commonly widespread. Spread in France, although it's obviously taking over. So I think as a profession, it's always been, d difficult to change the Architectural, the process of designing buildings is a long process.

It's not so everything goes in hand with this. However, if we come back to this question of how do you teach Architecture in the future, I think I ask myself first of all what is important to teach? We could start with a question of why do we actually study for five years? What is it that you do during these five years that you cannot do in, in, in in a much shorter time?

Yeah, and I think the crucial thing here is that we develop critical thinking because we're Exposed to the making of Architecture over this time, and this is our main tool. My experience as a tutor for over [00:33:00] 10 years made me really realize that what we learn and what we teach the students is how to look.

We, we teach them where, like, how to look at things differently. How what are they seeing? And that's really that has to remain crucial. I think it's this hands on. Training is an essential part of our of our curriculum and of what we come out with after these five years.

Now, I think the question here is is how much do you learn and what do you learn through making through. Through actually designing buildings, proposals, developing concepts, and and with these new tools coming up is like what is the, how much will the creative process be affected by them?

How. Of course you could already, this happened in the past already. I, when I was a student, I spent a lot of time hours drawing a perspective, drawing two point perspective, drawing on my big drawing board. And it was actually a very nice moment with the playing beautiful music and.

And suddenly seeing this kind of the three-dimensional drawing of the space emerge on, on, on [00:34:00] the paper. And you would do one because it would take you days to obviously today. And then when I, as a teacher, obviously and and all the three dimens, three d softwares coming along this the perspective or the three dimensional views were something that was very quick to generate.

And actually you, yeah. See that the, this generation was designing through a three dimensional view and not through two dimensions, for example. So I think this question of how the tools are affect our our knowledge, our teaching our training, our crucial. My question with the, these artificial intelligence tools today are whether is there a paradigm shift because of the speed of production, of the quantity of images that you can produce, of the of the quantity of options that are put forward?

And it's a question like do, is it the same to, to look at two, three good renders or to have 60 of them because it's just so easy to generate. What, what does it mean for your for this creative process? And I think those are the questions that we should ask [00:35:00] ourselves as as teachers and as people who.

Pass this knowledge onto the next generation, and another question there is what gives you these the tools to make a judgment? Yeah. How when I see a plan what is the difference that between me with my experience looking at a plan and judging it and my nine year old daughter looking at it and saying, yes, I like it.

I like the stairs there, or I don't, yeah. Put it very simply. But I think that those are the questions that go into the education and which we will have to ask ourselves as a profession. How do we use those productively to To for the needs that the society will require in the future.

As you said, of course, it also means that we have, because a lot of the the things we do will be automated. It gives us also a lot of time to do other things. If I have the AI gives me options of of layouts to choose from, which would've taken me a week to come up with what did I use that week to do?

[00:36:00] Could I study more on correct sustainable? New topics that have come up or new new knowledge acquiring on all sorts of different things that an Architect needs to know and master. So I think that's very important questions that we could ask. There's also the human relation aspect.

What the AI won't replace is the relationship you have with a client. How do you understand grief? How do you trans, how do you read between the lines of what a client is telling you? How do you accommodate that with the realities of of a site of regulations? How do you transcribe that?

All of the kind of human aspect of of the profession, which will become very important. And do we need to, is that something that we need to put emphasis on, on, on teaching? Yeah it's very, I think it's very interesting what you say and to touch upon that as a business owner there's a lot of things as and as architects, if you are, if you have a practice, you are a business owner as well as a designer, and there's a lot of mundane staff.

That we all do, that this [00:37:00] AI can really help with. Everything online is websites. SEO is a pain in the ass. However, if you can get these scripts to help you out, it's really useful, mundane stuff. It's amazing. And you laugh, but I thought this very fitting for this. So the thumbnail the thumbnail I've made, which is your beautiful images, but the description in the schedule is all ai.

And I looked at it, I put it in and I was like, it's fine. And you just say, put it in this tone. And I was like, Okay. That one, I'm not too sure of. The second one, I was like, great, that works. And it was just one less thing I had to think about less because actually I'm more concerned about us and our conversation in the moment unscripted, that's real.

But the description I'm not too worried about, so it's so even me, I'm challenging my processes. Yeah. What I was gonna say, now maybe we can flip the script and you can ask me any questions, but also it's probably Last Chance Saloon. If [00:38:00] anyone in the audience wants to ask Natalie a question before you go back to making these beautiful buildings.

But while if things come in, then I'll bring them on. But is there any questions you want to throw back to me before we round up? Yes. I think there, there are a number of questions here. So I think it would be interesting to hear from the audience of what their what their thoughts are on some of the topics that we've we've addressed.

I think especially, I'm very interested to hear about what the younger generations are Are thinking and how do they see that as a threat or not at all? And as a, just as a tool and how they're using that. And also what kind of ideas are they coming up with in terms of what how they will direct their professional lives with these new tools.

Do you we talked about it briefly before we started the livestream. I think that you, the advent of the Architect as a render render. Renderer CGI producer, and that was a profession that is stems from a new technology that, that, that came up that that that didn't exist before.

So what are [00:39:00] these new kind of offshoots in Architectural professional of the Architectural profession that will emerge? Yeah. And this how we, how will our jobs evolve? I think that's a very interesting and exciting topic. I don't know what your thoughts are about this, Dean.

As you see a lot of people in, on the job, in the job market, what type of jobs are they looking for? Is it something that that is starting to emerge as a sector in the profession? Ooh, good question There. I tell you what I'm, while I was listening. I was clicking away because this is the exhibition I went to Hamza Shake.

And so it's blueprints for a dream, the new age of visual Architecture. And this got to the Guardian, right? So people are talking about it, how hard it is as a business owner sort of things to get online and I think that it was quite interesting seeing this in person, but I think you're right.

It there's this experimental part of it, which is actually amazing. It's interesting. It's on topic, it's on trend, but like you say, [00:40:00] Just whacking out stuff in Mid Journey for the sake of it probably. Isn't that interesting? I paid for the subscription. You generate a few things and then you think, oh, where does it go from there?

So it's goes back to the purpose. We are a designer and I think that the, some really successful Architecture students that I'm seeing or interesting projects are using that tool to blur the edges or like you say, Which I loved and what you said earlier, it's just using these tools to do the mundane stuff, to favor your thought process, to get, to learn quicker.

Like you said. There's something nice about the discipline that you did years ago with that perspective. Having said that, to generate it quicker and to go further on your project, it's a different trade off and I think it's absolutely fine. I can see we've had one or two forts come in as well. So Abir says I think AI will help aid our creative process and take over the profession.

I ag I agree with that. But also Ishka, who kindly wrote the [00:41:00] question in earlier has said she's not had chance to learn AI as a so in university. But definitely looking forward to playing around with it in the profession. If I hit chance. So it feels all quite optimistic, doesn't it? So far? Yeah, I think so.

Yeah. I also just to tell, I, I don't think it's it's not necessarily something that you have to learn as such, but it's actually brings on an interesting question as to will. Will that become a course in an Architectural Oh wow. Curriculum of learning how to use these tools. But, and there are actually yet workshops out there today and some that are that.

Participating as members of our office are taking as well to learn how to, because it is a tool that you have to learn how to use. You can play around with it or you can learn to use it to, to create what you're actually trying to direct or improve on it. I, I think though that it's def it's definitely positive.

It opens up so much creative po potentials and possibilities. It's a great tool to express atmospheres of an idea to present something as [00:42:00] reference images as well. So I definitely see all the kind of positives in that happening. I think I am very still really fascinated about the importance of the prompt in there because I, I think, that our profession for the moment, which is, which was very visually visual based actually has to now stand the test of words again.

And that's maybe something that is Will be very interesting to see how it, that is observed culturally as well. Does it, because, and how, what I was gonna say with that is how do we contribute to this process happening? Most of the words that mid journey is taken is are, let's say in English today.

So whatever, if you don't speak English well and you don't use those same words Oh, very good point. Result Wow. So then obviously the tools translate the words, but is the translation the correct translation that you wanted to give as a con connotations to that word or not? And I think as architects we could also ask, how do we participate in this, in, in this process?

How do ensure [00:43:00] that these tools are not biased into as to what they're showing how do we direct it? How do we, as I mentioned before, how do we start creating our. Artificial intelligence database of where the machine is looking for the information to generate something.

How do we teach it to learn what we wanted to, what we wanted to learn for your personal practice or, for a larger group of people. But I think tho those are very interesting questions of of where the profession might be also going and how we should step in and. And have our word well said.

I think as you say, it will be interesting to see where it goes. The last little thought from Robert Dick that comes in is he's excited about how it bridges free and creative from the mundane and typical boring projects. There you go. Each to their own, but I think it's super exciting space as well.

I also think that what you do in your practice is exciting and is amazing as well. So on that note, just before we [00:44:00] end the live stream, and I'm gonna put a little clap then, cause it's been a really interesting one. I'm gonna bring up your website once again. Thanks. Where can people find you if they want to, if they watch the replay or they get excited, they wanna reach out, how do they find you?

So we're we're on Instagram, on LinkedIn, of course the website and you can register to our newsletter, which is the best way to keep updated with with the news and practice and our our studios work. All these social medias we talk also I participate to quite a lot of Talks and and conferences.

So it's always great to, to reach out to us on those to to come and ask interesting questions. We also what we are developing in, in, in the practice is what we call name talks. Every few weeks or months, we kinda organize these talks that for the moment are quite internal to the practice, but we have the ambition of opening them up and people to come and kinda exchange ideas on topics such as this one.

We're really excited to open these these discussions up and bring [00:45:00] something to the profession which is not necessarily the actual additional. Technical knowledge or testing the tool, but the larger questions that come that, that come around this, the, these topics and how we can not just do, but also think while we're doing and to what direction we wanna take this.

Brilliant. I really appreciate you making the time, cuz I know you've got all these kickass projects on at the moment. So thank you once again for making the time to be here. Thank you. And on that note, I'm probably gonna shut down the lunchroom at this time. So thank you for making the time as well to join us during your lunch break.

If you didn't manage to come in live and you seen the replay though, Do reach out to Natalie at name Architecture, and we've got some cool other live streams coming up next week as well. I'll schedule those soon. Maybe we'll get Natalie back because like you said, this space is moving so fast.

Exactly. It's pleasure. It'll be interest, it'll be interesting to see how long this stays relevant for, and maybe it'll be a piece of time [00:46:00] in this in between zone. Who knows? I think we should definitely catch up in another six month and see what we've learned since. It would, it might be a totally different episode.

Isn't that Matt? Okay. Thank you so much, Natalie. I'm gonna end the livestream. You, and thank you to the audience, Natalie. Stay on the stage while I shut it down. And guys, thank you so much. Good luck getting to the end of your day. Don't worry, it's Thursday. You're almost there. Thank you. Take care. Bye-bye.

Thank you. Bye-bye.